Lewiston Council debates budget cuts, police staffing, and revaluation concerns

[2:14] Carl L. Sheline: Hello and welcome to our Tuesday evening budget workshop, Administrator Cain Raff. Do you want to kick things off by outlining the process and timeline for amendments, budget amendments? Sure. Thank you, Mr. Mayor. So as discussed in our meeting last week [2:34] Bryan Kaenrath: We've said this Thursday end of business for amendments to be due into staff. Half the packet will go out normal schedule, obviously deadline Wednesday, will go out on Thursday, and we will consider amendments in regular session on the 19th at our meeting. I was discussing earlier with the mayor and council president, it may be advisable for us to have a workshop next Tuesday to consider amendments and workshop amendments prior to the regular meeting. We'll have all amendments in the Thursday prior so we should have everything in. If there's interest in doing a workshop next Tuesday evening in advance of our regular meeting on Thursday, how do counselors feel about that? I [3:28] Carl L. Sheline: think we're, counselor Chittum, did you want to say something? Yeah, I'm [3:32] David B. Chittim: concerned about, I think it's important that we have that because the way the amendments are presented to us, if there are more than one could obviate the other, so I think we need to work through that first before we do that, so I'm in [3:46] Bryan Kaenrath: favor of a workshop on. Right, and there could be some, you know, obviously some commonalities among your amendments, and in advance of it going in the packet, it may be a good idea to sort of call some of these amendments and have something that's sort of very clear ready to go for the meeting the following week. That will be the goal. Thank you. Anything [4:09] Carl L. Sheline: further, Administrator Kenra? That's all for now, thank you. Okay, we still have quite a bit of our budget workshop left. Do counselors want to bring up any budget workshop items? [4:23] David B. Chittim: Yes, I'd just like to make certain that I'm working from the most current budget. Is that the one that's dated 429? Correct. Okay. And that does not obviously have the details in it, but those can be obtained by drilling down through the information that's on that sheet into the actual budget that was presented to us at the beginning of the session. [4:46] Bryan Kaenrath: Correct, and I had sent you a list of all of those items in an email, I believe to all council, to show what those reductions and the ads to the revenues work [4:56] David B. Chittim: So you have that amount. Very much appreciated. Thank you, director [5:03] Bret Martel: Yes, come sir. Martel. Thank you. Miss mayor. I have a question for director Roy. I'm looking to get some clarification on that's okay. If we were to say hypothetically do a 90-day hiring freeze, would we be able to immediately free up that money for the general fund for, say, salaries, benefits, and everything else that's already been saved and budgeted for that? So if we were to freeze that, could we immediately put that money back into the general fund? We could still take applications and do interviews but not hire or put anyone in the books for 90 days, and could we immediately free up that money? [5:40] Bryan Kaenrath: Are you talking about this fiscal year? Yes. So we could do a carry forward if you recommend carrying forward those salary savings to next fiscal year but I would not recommend we wouldn't interview somebody to tell them that they wouldn't be hired for another three six months most people have would go out and find another job so my recommendation wouldn't be to interview [6:10] Bret Martel: Individuals. Well I understand that. I guess what I meant to say was it can sometimes take time to get through the hiring process so if we were to take say 90 days without putting anyone on the books I would say with the exception of the police department for current reasons in general reasons of being so short-staffed if we did that can we recognize the savings immediately regardless of you know whether you interview people or not if we do a 90 day freeze can we take the money that's already Been budgeted and put it right in the in the [6:43] Bryan Kaenrath: General fund as long as other lines have come in other under and not over that need to be covered for the general fund it's always the bottom line of how the expenditures and revenues finish for the year to what's brought over for fund balance so [7:05] Bret Martel: Those things aside if we did the freeze that money would immediately be available that's what you're saying recommendation or not just if we do it is the money immediately available because it's already been budgeted we're not going to use it if we were to pass an amendment saying we're not going to use it does it free that money up immediately because it we won't hire anyone if the funds are available [7:24] Bryan Kaenrath: At the end of the year we can't just say okay so if we do a freeze and it saves 60 000 if like say winter came in higher than 60,000 that would cover that amount so it until we finish the year and make sure that our funds are all reconciled and all the expenses and revenues are in you can't say for definite what's gonna [7:51] Bret Martel: Be carried forward, so then in theory, if we didn't do the hiring freeze and say winter fees or expenses came in sixty thousand dollars more than expected, in that would take us even further into the negative hypothetically than if we hadn't done the hiring freeze, still budgeted for that money and winter [8:09] Bryan Kaenrath: Expenses went over, we would have come back to you. I'm just using winter as an example, so kind of give you an idea. I'm just stating that until the final numbers are in, we can't say well we're gonna carry forward sixty thousand not knowing how all the other lines, because there could be an emergency that comes in, you know, something at Public Works that happens that they need to repair that would end up taking that money, so you can't say it's a guarantee until we get closer, and that's why we start Looking at all the encumbrances in June, end of June, July, to make sure that those funds are available. We wouldn't carry [8:53] Bret Martel: Forward money that we don't have available. Okay, I think I've got the answer to my question, thank you very much. [9:02] Carl L. Sheline: Further questions, comment. Councilor Longchamps. Yes, thank you, Mayor. [9:06] Susan G. Longchamps: I know you have said this number before, Director Roy, but to maintain our parks, how much is set aside for that in our budget again? Good [9:41] Kevin Gonge: Evening, Kevin Gonge, Director Public Works. I have a report showing with overtime and regular time, our 16 parks are right around $70,000. [9:57] Susan G. Longchamps: $70,000 to maintain them? [10:00] Kevin Gonge: Correct. And that is in just labor. So I want to preface that. That's not materials or equipment rentals. So the question asked last time was what we were spending on overtime. Time, so we're spending about 27,000 of regular time and 40,000, almost 41,000, and over time to maintain 16 parks, so [10:27] Susan G. Longchamps: 70,000 basically. Correct, thank you. [10:31] Carl L. Sheline: Anything further? Counselor Najing, did you have something? Yeah, the parks and [10:37] Joshua L. Nagine: Open Spaces budget is 1.7 million total. Is that include projects? Correct, that [10:43] Kevin Gonge: Would include any of the equipment rentals, fuel. I'm just giving you the labor costs. It would also include materials and supplies, overseeding, and anything we're doing depending on the specific park, cleanup, disposal. Okay. [10:59] Joshua L. Nagine: Could we possibly all as a council get the email with the breakdown of the different parks and the expenses? Absolutely. Okay, thank you. [11:09] Susan G. Longchamps: Counselor Longchamps, did you have something else? Yeah, so basically I'd like to see if we could maybe shave that amount down a bit, maybe by 150,000, if possible. So if we could get that breakdown, that would be great. Thank you. [11:29] Carl L. Sheline: Further comments, questions from counselors about the budget. [11:35] Joshua L. Nagine: Counselor and aging, one of the things that keeps coming up and I just want to KIND OF SURFACE THIS, so administrative costs with the five staff members are a little heavy, and I believe that Joe Grokmal is currently working partially within the economic development department, and I'm wondering, because of the fact that we are short right now for economic development, if we could possibly move more of his salary into the TIF funds in order to reduce from the I don't know what the plan is. And so I'm just asking, and I know that we're looking at hiring a new economic development director, so some of these things that may be changeable, but [12:15] Bryan Kaenrath: Just want some feedback on that, right? So we are using the maximum allowable for that position in TIF funds. But I believe, correct, nothing wrong is 35%. That [12:29] Joshua L. Nagine: comes from the general budget no matter what, okay. [12:38] Carl L. Sheline: Was that it, councillor in aging? GENE FOR THE MOMENT, YEAH, UH, COUNCILOR LONGCHAMP'S BACK TO YOU IN [12:46] Susan G. Longchamps: OUR BUDGET UM AS FAR AS FROZEN POSITIONS, THE POLICE DEPARTMENT HAS ONE POLICE OFFICER OR NONE, THEY [12:55] Bryan Kaenrath: HAVE, THEY HAVE UM I BELIEVE THREE FROZEN POSITIONS. WE HAD TWO LAST YEAR, WE FROZEN ANOTHER ONE, SO THERE'S THREE FROZEN, THREE [13:08] Susan G. Longchamps: police officers, and how many from our fire department, if any? There are none for fire. [13:15] Bryan Kaenrath: Public works is eight,, and finance is one, so that's the 12 positions we froze. [13:23] Carl L. Sheline: Thank you, director Roy. For police, how many, I know we froze three, but how many positions are open right now? I would refer to the chief. Conley. Thank you, good evening. [13:46] Unidentified speaker (Police Chief): SO CURRENTLY WE HAVE TWO FROZEN AND SEVEN VACANT. IT WOULD BE NINE IF WE DIDN'T HAVE THE TWO FROZEN. AND THEN THIS YEAR'S BUDGET, THE PLAN IS TO FREEZE AN ADDITIONAL POSITION. [14:02] Carl L. Sheline: HOW MANY, I SEE. SO HOW MANY POSITIONS ARE, LIKE IF AN OFFICER SHOWED UP TODAY AND WANTED TO BE HIRED, COULD WE HIRE THEM? LIKE HOW MANY OPEN POSITIONS DO WE HAVE? [14:12] Unidentified speaker (Police Chief): With the frozen positions, we have seven vacancies right now, okay, so we could hire seven officers [14:19] Carl L. Sheline: right now, okay, thank you, counselor and aging, or sorry, one, what did, okay, yeah, sorry, counselor [14:27] Joshua L. Nagine: and aging, then back to counselor lunch. Thank you, mayor, chief, just to verify, so we have two frozen positions right now, and we had created two positions in 2022 I believe that were never were able to be filled, we had I believe we had budgeted for three positions total one [14:46] Unidentified speaker (Police Chief): Was filled and two were not, if I'm correct on that. I honestly, I'm not certain back in 2022 when those positions were created, but if we're full complement, we should be 86. And we had [14:59] Joshua L. Nagine: A conversation about the possibility of freezing one additional officer, with the understanding that there was a possibility that position would not be filled, and that if you could fill it, you would come before council to ask for a supplemental budget in order to pay for that officer. Is that correct? Yes, yep. Okay, so we could technically remove one more officer position for the moment due to the fact that we do not believe that we'll be able to recruit that officer [15:24] Unidentified speaker (Police Chief): This year. I think it's just a matter of how many positions we currently have available, along with we know that three individuals will be retiring this summer, so I think we'll have some wiggle room, per se, if you were to freeze another position, but I would certainly like the opportunity, if we could fill them all, if we could come back to you and have that opportunity. I would strongly recommend if we get [15:46] Joshua L. Nagine: Enough applicants that are that are able to be hired, that you come back and ask for however many positions you need to fill. For sure, thank you. [15:57] Susan G. Longchamps: counselor long champs thank you mayor thank you chief so we originally budgeted for two frozen positions we've just asked for a third but you will still be able to hire seven officers [16:12] Unidentified speaker (Police Chief): Is that right? Yeah, so last year we froze two. Okay, this year we're going to freeze one more, so that would be three, and then it's my understanding that there's potential to freeze a fourth, and I think we would be able to sustain that fourth position. Okay, thank you. Thank you. Can I [16:34] Susan G. Longchamps: Talk about the fire department, or have the chief come up? One second before we do all that, [16:41] Carl L. Sheline: Give me one second. Council Roy, did you have something for the police chief? Yes, thank you. [16:46] Michael R. Roy: You, how many officers do we currently have that live in the city? Can I ask [16:53] Unidentified speaker (Police Chief): That question right now? Off the top of my head, I don't know. That I would say probably 25, 30, but I can certainly get that to you. Okay, I'd appreciate that. [17:02] Carl L. Sheline: Thank you. Any more questions for police chief Conley? Thank you very much. Thank you, chief Karen. Are you here? Yes, you are. Okay, thank you. Counselor [17:23] Susan G. Longchamps: Lunches. Thank you, mayor. Thank you, chief Karen, for being here. How many positions do you currently have out to hire? [17:33] Unidentified speaker (Fire Chief): Do you have any open positions? So currently I have one actual vacancy, but the way it works is when someone retires, we have to, you know, the position has to be posted, and then an opportunity for bidding, so it takes a few weeks before it's actually open. And then when we do hire people, it's, we hire in groups because we have to, you know, you know, six or eight weeks of training. We can't just hire someone and put them on a truck. So I have two current vacancies, and then tomorrow Captain Daniels will be retiring after 41 years, so I'll have three tomorrow. Great, well, congratulations [18:12] Susan G. Longchamps: to him and thank him for his service for us, for certain. So with the two vacancies that you have, would you be comfortable freezing the two of them to help our [18:22] Unidentified speaker (Fire Chief): budget share I don't believe so two of them would be it would be a big ask because those entry-level positions offset the overtime if you froze one of them I could move the other two around amongst the three shifts to offset the overtime if I had a long-term sick leave or an injury leave but if you were to freeze to it would it would impact the overtime line it would increase it thank you thank you counselor Nijing chief Karen I want to [19:01] Joshua L. Nagine: thank the department overall for the service that they perform in the community. I should have also brought that up with the other chief, but I realized that you're not just putting out fires, you're also responding to pretty much every 99 call in the city, and so, you know, I think there are pressures there. I think that we all know that some of the contractual agreements make the overtime requirements inefficient, so we cannot do scheduling changes at the moment. In order to, the only choice for driving down overtime is to hire more firefighters at this moment, and I think that's a difficult place to be in a very tough budget year. So I just, I just want to acknowledge that because it's what we're talking about, paying overtime versus losing actual employees that are, that are staffed, it's a challenge for us. You know, I do appreciate the one position that you're willing to freeze. I would mention also so that in the past six years we've created two new positions for the department, one was a fire marshal and one was the deputy chief, and so if the one position is what you can give, understood, but again, we're just dealing with a very tough budget here, so yeah, so I'll just since [20:21] Unidentified speaker (Fire Chief): You brought it up. I'll briefly talk about the fire prevention staff. So the deputy chief was brought back, was received funding a couple years ago. That was one of the positions that was eliminated in 2010 when there was a mass layoff throughout the city, and it took that many years to get it refunded. So I'm reluctant to call it a new position. It was sort of new positions position we always had and was just not funded for a period of time. It's definitely needed and he does a good job. The third fire inspector that you're making reference to that came up of the housing committee and the rental registration where they needed an additional body to address the unsafe living conditions downtown and the blight. So and I think he does a good job. He's very busy all day keeping the landlords downtown accountable for their properties. They're not always happy with him, but you know, you know, it's just the way it is. You know, if someone tells you need to spend money to make your building say if you know you might not be happy, but it's necessary. So I would definitely support, you know, that position. I would, I would argue against eliminating funding for it. Thank you, chief. Councillor Nagine, yeah, I [21:41] Joshua L. Nagine: would, I wasn't inferring that we would want to eliminate one of the two new positions, because I think that the arguments that were put forward make sense to keep them. One of the things that we were doing in the past was offsetting the cost of one of those fire marshals through rental registry program, and going forward I think that we do need to, and it's not going to fix this budget year unfortunately, but we do need to look at licensing home health care offices and other organizations within our city that get calls for service, and possibly we could look at those revenues that are coming in to offset some of the costs of those positions, because first responders positions are absolutely necessary in the city. There's no question. The, I think the concern that we're having is just unfilled positions versus filled positions, and the argument that you're making that basically it's going to run us more over time than the positions worth makes sense to keep that one unfilled position at the moment in there, if you're willing to sacrifice the other one for this budget here as a, it's a frozen position, not a removed [22:49] Unidentified speaker (Fire Chief): Yeah, I mean, if you're telling me that, you know, you need the positions, I there is some savings that, you know, I can shuffle them around, some flexibility. But I would, I would, you know, caution against more than one because those that will, you know, impact the overtime line. [23:08] Joshua L. Nagine: Okay. Thank you. Chief Karen. Appreciate it. [23:12] Carl L. Sheline: Yeah, counselor long champs back to you [23:19] Bret Martel: Councilor Martel. Yes. Thank you. Mr. Mayor. Thank you, chief. Thank you to the fire department, what you guys do for the city. It's very important. I'm very much pro-public safety and first responders. I'm just looking at some difficult realities in front of me. Our police department has nine current openings, and that could go up with retirements this summer. Recently, we've had some serious public safety issues that I think make that even a little bit more concerning. I'm looking at Public Works that's down 8 currently, and that's obviously very important department in our city, keeping roads paved, and I mean, it's municipality safe for residents. So I guess it's just hard for me, like, I get that it's unfortunate and it might not be ideal, and I would hate to see more over time. But, you know, eight, nine, you know, we're fighting for one or two. I mean, there's a lot of need in a lot of departments, and we've got to cut some taxes up here. So I just hope that you'd understand that and, you know, hopefully work with us. I would like to see the two, and that's not because I have anything against the fire department or that I think you aren't trying. I'm just looking at the numbers that I have in front of me. And you know if we're gonna be down nine in the police department and eight in public works You know one in the fire department it seems like you know The dick the difficulty needs to be spread across the board a little more Equitably, I guess it is the way that I'm looking at So I hope that you would consider working with us on both of those positions as difficult as it might be [25:06] Carl L. Sheline: Thank you everyone. So I want to make sure we're, you know, kind of thinking about things correctly. We're not, I mean, we are talking about some positions, but we're talking about saving money, and so Chief Karen, we need to have 17 people on at all times. [25:21] Unidentified speaker (Fire Chief): Yes, we're actually obligated to staff with 17 people daily. [25:25] Carl L. Sheline: Right, and so that's where some of this overtime is covering coming from, and so if we're, you know, it sounds like we'll be, you know, for cutting positions of the fire department, sounds like, well, we could be saving money, but I'm not sure that we will be, especially if there's, you know, given the fact that we need to maintain 17 people at all times. And I guess if we're going forward in this discussion, I would love for you to work with Director Roy to figure out what would be the actual financial hit. You know, do we actually save money if we get, you know, is the overtime less than the position that we've saved? And so if it is, then yes, that saves money. But if for some reason it is not, then cutting position will not save money. It will actually cost us more. So I guess I just want to make sure we're making decisions based on data. [26:19] Unidentified speaker (Fire Chief): Yeah, if I may, so we did this exercise a couple years ago with the, our personnel contractually, I can have, for the council has funded three. So I've always had one more available that could have been funded, so I did the exercise, and a few years ago, the math worked out that if that R person was utilized 70% of the time, it was cost effective. So that was the cutoff point. I mean, if it was 70% or greater that they were in a spot saving overtime, but if it was, if not, then it was just easier to pay the overtime. And I can do that again with current wages. I can resurrect that. [27:09] Carl L. Sheline: I would appreciate that, thank you. yes, back to you, Consultant Martell, thank you. yeah, I guess. [27:14] Bret Martel: My question would be if being down that position is going to drive up over time, it's say we were to say come back to you and say, all right, let's open up three entry level firefighter positions, can you predictively come back to us and tell us how much savings that we'll have on overtime, so maybe we can find savings there, maybe we give you, instead of cutting, maybe we give you three spots and you tell us that we can cut your overtime budget by x amount of dollars so that. [27:41] Unidentified speaker (Fire Chief): We find a net savings. Well, so there's a lot of variables in there, you know, the firefighter pay scale is 18 steps, an entry-level firefighter is step one, so that replacement firefighter who's working for straight time is working at the very lowest possible wage contractually versus a 10-year employee working overtime or maybe a lieutenant working overtime for 24 hours, so there, you know, the, it's hard to predict, so when I do, when I, you know, when I run this model, it's, it's, you know, based on a median. Wage, because I can't predict, you know, which person is going to be out on any given day. [28:24] Bret Martel: Good, but if we have more towards the lower end of the spectrum, whether they're on straight time or overtime, then it would end up cumulatively having less of a strain on your budget and say that time or overtime at someone at a higher step level. So I'd be saying let's see if we could bring in some of those lower-level entry positions and kind of cut back on some of the overtime hours of the more stepped-up firefighters. [28:50] Unidentified speaker (Fire Chief): Yeah, I mean, that is the purpose that we have replacements is to reduce overtime. And that's when I had that conversation with Councilman Eugene, I, you know, one, I could probably work around that. you know you know transferring them to the shifts that have you know the most you know a long-term leave or an injury but with even with three it's one per shift so it's you know this you know if I had to you know one of the shifts would have no replacements in every vacancy every day would be filled with [29:27] Bret Martel: overtime. I just, I mean, I'm not trying to take your positions, or I don't want to see the fire department understaffed for any reason. I'm, we're literally up here trying to find savings, and so if we can have a conversation in the best way in which to do that, it still allows you to do the very important job that you're tasked with, but can save the taxpayers some money. I just think that's an important conversation to have and some math that should [29:52] Unidentified speaker (Fire Chief): be done. Yeah, I appreciate it, thank you. If I could also just circle back to the fees that you had briefly mentioned, I'd be happy to work with, if the council would support fees for inspections and for services, I'd be happy to work with you on developing a more robust fee schedule, just knowing that, you know, you'll be the, have to hear from your constituents. [30:18] Joshua L. Nagine: yes, back to you, Councilor Najing. Yeah, I mean, ultimately our revenue streams, we have to diversify past just the tax base, so the rate payer for a service in certain cases probably should be looking at an increased cost, as long as it's matching what the actual cost is, right? And so I would love to have some further conversations about that for sure. I also just for the, like, public's understanding, how long have we had 17 firefighters staffed as a [30:52] Unidentified speaker (Fire Chief): a contract, contractual obligation, like how long has that been? So we went, we went up to 17, I think, in 2017. Prior to that it was 16. So we added an additional firefighter on the ladder truck. [31:07] Joshua L. Nagine: In 2017. And that is not a requirement based on state or federal law or OSHA requirements that [31:14] Unidentified speaker (Fire Chief): Is that, is, well, it's an NFP recommendation that we have, and we're actually understaffed. They recommend that we would have five on the ladder and four per engine, and we have three per engine and four on the ladder. Okay, if, well, I can look it up or get in contact with you later about that. And if you, we're meeting the minimum standards where we meet the standard. Gotcha, okay, I appreciate that, thank you. Further [31:40] Carl L. Sheline: questions for Chief Karen? Thank you, Chief. Okay, thank you. Further questions from Councilors about the budget. Administrator Kaenerath, do you have anything? [31:55] Bryan Kaenrath: Nothing further, thank you. Director Roy. [31:59] Carl L. Sheline: I think we're calling the budget meeting early then. Councilor Najing, yes. [32:06] Joshua L. Nagine: I'm just wondering what it would take in this budget, if we, I don't think we have it in this budget, but what would it take to redesign the website so that it's, do we have an idea of how to update this web, like what's it going to cost the city to update the website so that it's like, I don't want to [32:25] Bryan Kaenrath: SAY USABLE BECAUSE IT IS USABLE BUT BETTER YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT TOTAL REDESIGN AND TOTAL REVAMP YEAH SO USUALLY THAT'LL BE DONE WITH A THIRD PARTY UM YOU KNOW THAT WE WOULD PUT OUT TO BID SO I DON'T HAVE AN IDEA OFF THE TOP OF MY HEAD OF COST ON THAT UH I'M NOT SURE IF UH WE HAVE OUR COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR IS HERE I'M NOT SURE IF WE'VE INVESTIGATED FURTHER WHAT IT WOULD TAKE AN OUTSIDE for them to do it okay and could i have an could i have an idea if that could that come from tiff funds potentially partially? I don't think so though, I don't, I don't think so, we could [33:00] Joshua L. Nagine: investigate. It's not considered to be like an economic development tool, I [33:06] Bryan Kaenrath: I wouldn't imagine so. We do have a portion in the budget to make the website ADA, so along with that they could take a look at the difference of the cost and we can see if we have any remaining funds from that to cover that. But I believe they revamped the website, was it two years ago, Angie? So I know we do have a piece in MIS's budget for the website along with the ADA that could most likely be used depending on how much of a restructure of the website [33:50] Joshua L. Nagine: would need to be done and that ad a requirement is a is a state mandate correct it's a state requirement it's federal okay thank you [34:00] Scott A. Harriman: Counselor Herman, thank you. I wonder if the council would find it appropriate to ask about revaluation questions now, or if that should wait till later. Yeah, we got a few minutes still, so I was wondering if there are any updates on the feasibility and the cost of phasing in the revaluation numbers, so [34:25] Bryan Kaenrath: the actual to phase in the reval. Those are the same numbers that we had presented previously. I will talk about in my report some numbers to extend the informal assessments. the scheduling passed May 15th, but as far as the reval numbers, we had that between 200 and 800,000 sort of scale based on what we were looking for. Were you looking for specific other detail in there? No, it was really that, and I didn't know if [34:55] Scott A. Harriman: that was any more, you know, 200 to 800,000 is a fairly big range. I didn't know if that had been narrowed down at all. I was thinking based on maybe a three year phase in. Yeah, our assessor does have [35:08] Bryan Kaenrath: some additional detail that can be forwarded to you. He's not available tonight. He's not here. But let me talk with him tomorrow. If you're looking for some general, more specific detail, perhaps we can e-mail that out to you tomorrow. But if you do have specific questions, let me know and we can get back to Tyler and get those answered. [35:27] Carl L. Sheline: Okay. Thanks. Yeah, well, just to, if I can jump in really quick, Administrator Kanarath, I think, no, and I remember from the workshop you had some questions, but there was not majority support to do a phase in, and so for the questions about, you know, the cost of the phase in were, yeah, since there wasn't majority support, like there just was not an advisable use of staffs time, but if Director Healey has information that's like freak, you know, available that he already has, he [35:58] Bryan Kaenrath: can certainly share it around. Yeah, no, we're certainly happy to answer any questions and get more information if an individual counselor like that. [36:05] Carl L. Sheline: Absolutely. All right, Administrator Kenroth, please say what you're going to say. I think I was done. Well, no, you were talking about the window for appointments. That's part [36:18] Bryan Kaenrath: of my report for the regular meeting, and oh, okay, 20 minutes. I could do it now if you'd like, or [36:22] Carl L. Sheline: we can wait to do it in the report. We can wait, I guess. Okay, yeah. Counselor Longchamps, did you [36:27] Susan G. Longchamps: have something? Part of your report is regarding the reval, is that what you said? Yes, just some [36:33] Bryan Kaenrath: Updates on we had discussed extending beyond May 15th the time to schedule informal hearings on your new assessment, so we have some numbers of what that would entail and some general information there about where we stand with how many of requested appointments to date. [36:51] Susan G. Longchamps: Great, that was pretty much going to be my any questions I had, we are building up building up. [36:57] Carl L. Sheline: suspense for our administrators report later on in the meeting counselor noble so i've had [37:05] Scott A. Harriman: Constituents reach out asking me or complaining that when they reached out to Tyler Technologies to find out what they used for the numbers, they're being told they're not being told what was used for those numbers, and I'm wondering if we can find out that information. When you say not being told what was used, what do you mean, like what they used to come up with people's re the eval, what the actual process that they've used to, what did they use to get those numbers, some people had appraisals done. Recently and they didn't come in anywhere near the number, like an independent market appraisal, yeah, so I don't know if that's information that we can get, like how the process went down and how they got that money number for. [37:52] Bryan Kaenrath: Each property, let me talk about our assessing department, they can I'm sure shed some more light on exactly the process used, or we can get something specific from Tyler, but I'm sure Bill Healy knows exactly the process used by one of these companies to come up with their new assessment. [38:10] Susan G. Longchamps: Councilor Longchamps, just to share with Councilor Noble that I believe most of how they did this was basically went to the property, took pictures of the home or building, also looked at the land, how much land was there. But when you have an appraisal done, to get it at its real value, they would have to go in the home, look at your crown molding, your doors, there's lots of things. Things so most homes will actually be assessed at a much lower rate than what they're actually. [38:49] Carl L. Sheline: Valued at, if we can have it quiet in the council chambers I would appreciate it, thank you, please. [38:53] Susan G. Longchamps: Continue Councilor Longchamps, so just to share that with you, from what I've seen and heard. [38:59] Scott A. Harriman: Thank you, Councilor Herman. Yeah, I'd also like to find out more about what process they used and what they used for comps, because things I've been hearing from people and in my own experience is that the assessed value that's coming in, which I shared that understanding is that the city's assessed value is typically a little bit lower than market value, but the value that's coming in is significantly higher. And I believe we're also shooting for 95 and not 100, so that tax on another five percent on top of that. So it's, yeah, the values seem to be coming in generally quite a bit higher than what people expect. [39:41] Carl L. Sheline: I'm sorry we're we're in a workshop right now so I'm you'll be able to speak during public comment in the next meeting councillor Chittenden did you have something yes I'd like to go [39:55] David B. Chittim: back to the budget for just a moment. I want to make certain that we're all on the same page here. The Charter indicates that we need a supermajority if we're going to exceed the CPI. That number has been tossed around as being three point three percent. The actual calculation based on December is three point two five one, so if our goal is to hit that target, that's the number we have to hit. It would be too bad for us to come in at three point two nine and technically violate the Charter and do that with only a majority of four. So be aware, everybody, please, that the drop dead number for a four council, of four vote approval is 3.251 percent increase over the tax levy for last year. And based on the city attorney's memo, that includes the operating funds for the city, it includes the county tax, and it includes the, third one. The school, no, not the school budget. Debt service. Debt service, thank you. Thank you, Administrator. Debt service, city operating budget, county tax. All has to come in at 3.21% or lower over last year's figures, comparable figures. YEARS FURTHER [41:25] Carl L. Sheline: QUESTIONS FROM COUNCILORS ABOUT THE BUDGETS. COUNCILOR LONGCHAMPS [41:29] Susan G. Longchamps: YES, I WOULD JUST LIKE TO SHARE THAT I'M, I'M CONFIDENT THAT WE WILL GET THERE FURTHER [41:37] Carl L. Sheline: COMMENTS OR QUESTIONS ABOUT BUDGET OR REVAL? OKAY, ADMINISTRATOR KANERATH, DIRECTOR ROY, ANYTHING FROM YOU? ALL RIGHT, THIS CONCLUDES OUR BUDGET WORKSHOP. WE WILL BE RECONVENING AT 7. THANK YOU. HELLO AND WELCOME TO OUR Tuesday evening council meeting. APPRECIATE YOU ALL BEING HERE. IF WE CAN HAVE IT QUIET IN THE HALL, THAT WOULD BE GREAT. IF YOU NEED TO TALK, YOU CAN HEAD OUT TO THE HALLWAY OR TEXT EACH OTHER, BUT WE WILL HAVE IT QUIET IN HERE. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. YEAH, WE'RE GONNA HAVE A QUITE STARTING RIGHT NOW. THANK YOU. IS CHIEF CONNOLLY HERE? YES, THERE YOU ARE. CHIEF CONNOLLY HAS GRACIOUSLY AGREED TO KICK US OFF WITH THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE. CHIEF, THANK YOU VERY MUCH. MADAM CLERK, I BELIEVE WE'RE READY TO BEGIN. YES, THANK YOU MR. MAYOR, ALL ROLL CALL VOTES FOR THIS MEETING WILL BEGIN WITH THE COUNCILLOR OF WARD 2 AND I [1:03:17] Carl L. Sheline: UNDERSTAND YOU AND I UNDERSTAND WE HAVE MINUTES. WE DO THE MINUTES OF THE April 21st MEETING. HAVE A MOTION. MOVE TO APPROVE. COUNCILLOR CHITTUM. SECOND BY COUNCILLOR NEJI. AND MADAM CLERK, PLEASE CALL THE VOTE. YES. YES. THANK YOU VERY MUCH, MADAM CLERK. WE ARE NOW UP TO PUBLIC COMMENT PERIOD AND WE HAVE A FEW PUBLIC COMMENT PERIODS HERE. SO I'M GONNA QUICKLY OUTLINE THINGS AND THEN WE'RE GONNA GET GOING. SO THIS FIRST PUBLIC COMMENT PERIOD IS FOR ITEMS THAT ARE NOT ON THE AGENDA. WHAT WILL BE ON THE AGENDA FOR ITEM NUMBER FOUR IS THE FINAL BUDGET HEARING? FOR THE MUNICIPAL BUDGET. SO IF YOU WANT TO TALK ABOUT THE BUDGET, YOU NEED TO WAIT TILL ITEM NUMBER FOUR AND THEN WAY DOWN ON ITEM NUMBER. WHAT IS THAT, 16, WHICH WE WILL BE MOVING UP TO AFTER THE MUNICIPAL BUDGET? WE'LL BE TALKING ABOUT THE APPROVING THE BUDGET FOR LEWISTON SCHOOL DEPARTMENT. SO IF YOU WANT TO TALK ABOUT THE SCHOOL BUDGET, YOU WILL NEED TO WAIT UNTIL THEN. AND THIS NEXT PUBLIC COMMENT PERIOD IS FOR THINGS THAT ARE NOT RELATED TO THE SCHOOL BUDGET OR CITY BUDGET ANY. AND NOW I'M GONNA READ WHAT I NORMALLY READ HERE. ANY MEMBER OF THE PUBLIC MAY MAKE COMMENTS REGARDING ISSUES PERTAINING TO LEWISTON CITY GOVERNMENT. THIS BUDGET IS RESERVED FOR NON AGENDA ITEMS. PUBLIC COMMENT IS ALSO ALLOWED During individual agenda items, public comment is limited to three minutes per person. Please state your name for the record, and please indicate if you are Lewiston resident. Per our council rules, this period is reserved for Lewiston residents only. Because this is the business meeting of the City Council, all questions you'd be directed to the mayor, who asked up to follow up at a future time. It is illegal for the City Council to allow comments related to personnel matters. All personnel complaints should be made directly to the city administration office. [1:05:10] Janet Bowden: Janet Bowden, Ward 2. I'm here to talk about the reevaluation, not the budget. Is that acceptable? Okay. So I'm not here to argue that my home was overvalued. My concern is how it's being implemented and what it says about the city's long-term management. When a city goes 38 years without a full re-evaluation, the cost of that delay should not suddenly be dumped onto taxpayers all at once. It's not fair, and it's not good leadership. I bought my home in 2019 for 280 000, and I understand that market values change. What I don't quite understand is why the valuation of my home didn't increase from 198 to 280 when I purchased it. I certainly didn't purchase a 500 000 home, and my taxes really shouldn't reflect that. I absolutely do not accept a system that lets years of neglect build up and then shifts the full burden onto the current tax base in one shot. That punishes people who are still here, still paying, and we're still trying to hold on. You've already said a phase-in was considered to ease the impact, and that's exactly the kind of approach that should have been pursued from the start. The real issue that taxpayers are the real issue is that taxpayers are being asked to carry the consequences of decades of delay while getting very little in return. We have crumbling infrastructure, reoccurring water main breaks, empty storefronts, and no clear economic momentum that gives homeowners confidence in the future. But we certainly have plenty of low-income housing. Thank you for the one-year delay, but that's not gonna fix the underlying problem. The city should be working on a gradual rollout. That softens the blow instead of slamming homeowners with the full impact. If you want a stronger tax base, then build one. Bring in real economic development. Fill vacant buildings. Stop relying on the same shrinking group of taxpayers to solve all of your problems. As a middle class homeowner, I want to know where my representation is. I want to know what I'm getting for the taxes that I pay, because right now I'm seeing higher bills, fewer services, and a future that looks more expensive and not any better. Please don't punish the taxpayers who are left. Face this irresponsibly, and for the love of God, vote Republican in November. I like to [1:07:28] Carl L. Sheline: I'm sorry, there's no, there's no our signs of approval or disapproval in the council hall. Thank you, and there's also no campaigning during public comment. Please continue, sir. Matthew Lagran, Ward 5. Honorable council lers, mayor, and city administration members, I fear that you are all looking at pushing off this long overdue revaluation that we needed done for the past 38 years. I fear what you're doing is looking at pushing off the financial responsibility and fairness to the people because there's an election this year, and I expect at least some of you are planning on running again and are seriously worried about the tar and feathers and pitchforks that are coming out. I also assume that you want someone else to be the bad guys who are gonna have to hand out this bill to the taxpayers. It's been three years since this all started. Most of you sitting up there have been there the entire three years. Now, if we back it off one year, what's to stop the next council from saying, well, it was good to delay this for one year, why not two, and start kicking this down the slope again? Now, if you're saying we need to hold this off because these numbers aren't right, how much did we pay to have these numbers done? I'll be honest, I listened to Robert Reed who guessed about what the revaluation was going to multiply for the homeowner value, so I was not unprepared to see the uptick at some. Now, could the city of Lewiston have done better in warning the taxpayers what was to come down the pike? A thousand percent yes. Let's be honest here and say something that not many people want to talk about. We don't have big business projects coming to help absorb these blows. Instead, it's all going to fall on mostly the homeownership to foot the bills for the city. Well, at least until most of them start looking at selling and flooding the market here in Lewiston, and then crashing the housing market, which will then force another revaluation to fix these numbers. You all need to put on your big purse and panties, and instead of figuring out how to make this hurt not just this year, but going down, prepare a path so it doesn't hurt in the future either. I'll remind you, when your personal budget doesn't work, you have two real choices. PAYOUT CREDIT WHICH WILL COST YOU MORE IN THE END OR CUT OUT YOUR EXPENSES TO MAKE THE BUDGET WORK. I KNOW I PERSONALLY PREFER THE SECOND ONE. HAVE A NICE DAY. PLEASE CONTINUE, SIR. [1:10:18] Ray Toutain: RAY TOUTAIN, WARD 7. MRS. LONGCHAMP, I'M GLAD THAT YOU SAID YOU'RE GOING TO TRY LIKE HELL TO GET TO THAT 3.251. But I want to tell you a story that happened to me today in my neighborhood. I have a older woman lost her husband last year, she's 95 years old, she's got two adult sons that take care of her, but in my neighborhood we check on her and make sure once in a while that she's okay. Today she came up to me while I was walking with my wife, and she asked me if I got the tax evaluation, and I said yes we did. She said I don't know what I'm gonna do. I says well hopefully we have some city councillors that's gonna work their rear ends off to bring this down, so what you said I hope all of you think the same way that mrs. Longchamp does, but this woman at the end of the conversation looked at me and she says, I'm 95 years old. I hope I die before I get my tax evaluation. Now, if that doesn't touch any hot string on this goddamn board, you guys shouldn't even be on that board. 95 years old, lived at her house for 48 years, lost her husband, and she's scared to death. When you guys, now bring you back to when you campaigned, Mr. Sheline, you were at my house in my driveway for 20 minutes and you told me everything I'm going to say right now. I want to be mayor, I want to run, I want to do this and I hope I win my election because I want to help the city of Lewiston, I want to make it affordable for you people that lived in Lewiston. And I don't know if you're doing that right now. There's a sign that I'm sure you've seen all over the city of Lewiston. Mr. Jones running for governor in the bottom of this. [1:12:30] Carl L. Sheline: We are not campaigning. I'm not campaigning. [1:12:32] Ray Toutain: I'm telling you what I'm gonna tell you. In the bottom of it's sign it says, fight like hell. I'm sure you've all seen it. I hope that's what you're doing. Because it's time to look under every rock to try to save everything you can. And there's one more thing, Mr. Sheeline, that you should do as a mayor. It's time for Bates College to help us out. Bowdoin College helps Brunswick, Colby College helps the city of Waterville. It's time for them, don't call it a tax, call it whatever you want they have more money in escrow and endowments than the whole city of Lewiston it's time for you to get on the phone and call it's time thank you no I'm not done I'm sorry [1:13:24] Carl L. Sheline: We're three minutes for everyone we have a line thank you sir you have a great time that's what [1:13:28] Ray Toutain: I thought you'd do to escape this can I have someone's time no we do not share time here I'm sorry why not why can you not share time I got like 10 seconds 10 seconds to tell you something 10 seconds sir go ahead okay it's time for you to pick up your phone in your office and call the president of Bates College and get a meeting and ask him he might say no but we don't know and say we the Lewiston of people of Lewiston Maine need your help can you help us and I hope you do that but I don't Think you will thank you sir further [1:14:06] Carl L. Sheline: Public comment good [1:14:16] Destiny (Public Commenter): evening my name is destiny i'm a lucent shooting survivor thankfully i'm not from lewiston i'm from windham [1:14:25] Carl L. Sheline: Can I speak recognizing that the council has agreed to let you speak before please continue [1:14:31] Destiny (Public Commenter): You have three minutes thank you for the past several months I've been coming to these meetings and speaking during public comment now suddenly a rule is being enforced that limits speaking to Lewiston residents only this presents a problem for me a victim of a shooting incident in Lewiston that nearly claimed my life that change feels like a message that we should step back be quiet and move on but I'm here and I'm not going anywhere survivors and victims families will continue to show up Continue to speak and continue to ask questions until we get the answers we did NOT COME TO THE CITY COUNCIL ASKING FOR HELP MANAGING OUR PERSONAL NEEDS WHAT WE ASKED FOR CLEARLY AND CONSISTENTLY IS ACCOUNTABILITY SPECIFICALLY WE ARE SEEKING TRANSPARENCY IN ANSWERS REGARDING THE 1.9 MILLION THAT WAS DISTRIBUTED TO 29 NON-PROFITS NONE OF WHICH WERE PRESENT AT SMANGY'S OR AT THE BOWLEN ALLEY ON OCTOBER 25th 2023 WE ASKED FOR AN INVESTIGATION INTO HOW THOSE FUNDS WERE ALLOCATED that request still Stands right now, the city has a partnership with the main community foundation. Because of that relationship, it is responsible and reasonable for this council to ask the foundation to return the remaining funds so they can go directly to the victims and families they were intended for. So tonight I am asking a very direct question: what is the release date for the remaining 1.9 million that was raised for the survivors and victims of the Lewiston mass shooting? And I'm respect, respectfully, we question a response within 30 days. I escaped through the kitchen at Smengi's, others never made it out. The least we can do now is honor them, not just with words but with action, by ensuring that the support promise in their name is handled with fairness, transparency, and respect. Thank you. Thank [1:16:36] Carl L. Sheline: you. Thank you. Further public comment, please. Andrew [1:16:42] Lisa Jones: Jones, Ward Two. It's been a little bit since I've been here. Just have a couple of things I wanted to talk about. First one was last time I was here speaking, it was regarding a member of the council sicking the Louiston Police Department on me as well as the district attorney to try and deprive me of my First Amendment rights. I understand the explanation for why he does what he does, but that doesn't justify him attempting to weaponize the police against me, so shame on you, fascist. And it's a shame that the council declined to hold him accountable for that. One of the things I wanted to talk about was the public comment sessions. The first time I heard Carl say Lewiston residence and all that, I thought he was just making stuff up to try and prevent the David Joneses and the Quinton Chapmans and Ryan Salvadors from talking. But the Deputy Administrator was kind enough to point out the rule. And it just turns out that Carl's just never been enforcing it this whole time. And we had not a problem, so I would like to see that rule stricken because it's just curbing free speech. Those folks, they may not live in Lewiston, they may not pay taxes in Lewiston, but they have a vested interest in our city and should be able to speak. Furthermore, that rule does say Lewis and residents and taxpayers, that's a line that Carl omits when he reads it, and I would argue that there's plenty of taxpayers in Louiston that don't necessarily live here. If they buy a stick of gum, they're a taxpayer. I know it's probably supposed to mean property tax, but that's not what it says. Other than that, I would encourage folks to use 210 Blake Street as their address when they come here to speak because the council seems to be okay with that fraud. Last thing I want to talk about in my last minute here is the revaluation. It's my understanding that you're you're going to a phase in approach on that. I don't really agree with that. I think that it needs to be pushed through immediately. I think Brett's right, we got to rip the band-aid off, and that the council when they deal with the budget deal with some real hard cuts. Like he said, it's not cutting fat, it's lopping off limbs, and that's unfortunate, and I understand that people will lose their jobs as a result, but again this is a result of decades of mismanagement to that end I just point out that you know wards two four six as well as the mayor are up for reelection so people should probably consider that depending on how things play out tonight lastly I just want to remind everyone of David Chittim's words last year during the budget his words to anyone who was faced with losing their home as a result of Lewiston's budget he said that's life so again something that needs to be considered thank you yeah I won't give [1:19:45] Carl L. Sheline: you the opportunity further public comment. Hi [1:19:51] Lisa Jones: everyone, my name is Lisa Jones, I live in Ward 2 and I own a taxpaying business in Ward 7. I'm here tonight to talk about the shootings that keep happening in our city. When there's kids on my playground and I get a text from the superintendent that says there's a shooting and I have to get my kids inside, the shootings that happened twice last Thursday, twice last Wednesday, many nights before that as well. People in Lewiston are scared and tired of hearing gunfire. There's nothing from the leadership of the city afterwards, nothing. Residents deserve acknowledgement, reassurance, and transparency when serious violence happens in our community. Started thinking about what the role of a mayor is supposed to be. A mayor is the public face of a city. A mayor should respond during difficult moments with sympathy for victims, gratitude to first responders, a commitment to facts and transparency, and reassurance to the public. Well investigations proceed, a mayor should listen to residents concerns, address issues like public safety and work to improve quality of life. Instead we get silence. At this point many residents feel ignored and dismissed. I even looked into whether the mayor could be removed from office, but the city charter does not allow removal simply because residents disagree with the mayor's conduct or leadership style. The grounds are very limited. Because of that, I'm asking the City Council to do what it can, hold the mayor accountable during meetings, maintain professionalism and respect in these chambers. Too often counselors are steamrolled, interrupted, or spoken to disrespectfully, and the public notices it. There was a little rally of taxpayers organized before tonight's meeting, and I had intended to be there. It wrapped up before I got here, but I was nervous about somebody coming through and just going, oh, a bunch of people, because who's saying this is bad, stop. No one who walked away from a reporter four times last week when he was directly questions about gun violence in our city, that man, the one who claims to want to represent Lewiston, it's disgusting, and none of you do anything to hold him accountable. And I also have to add, with my remaining few seconds, I'm not even gonna finish what I had planned here. People in the audience are asking me to comment on counselor Harryman's behavior during public speaking, during public comment again tonight. It's a game for him at this point, clearly. Further [1:22:38] Carl L. Sheline: public comment. [1:23:02] Bob McDonald: Good evening, Bob McDonald's, board six. 50 years ago when I came to Lewiston, I watched, I was, I joined the police department happen. And I used to have to stand down on Ash Street and watch all these mill workers every day parade down the street and go home. And it didn't make any difference if it was snowing out or raining or sleeting, whatever. They came down there every day. Now, what I see is, if I go to the grocery store, I see the same people sitting there trying to make change, trying to get enough change to pay for their groceries. And while I'm watching this, that's in the morning. But if you come back there in the afternoon or at night, my God, all these welfare people have huge carts, and they're filled. When I was mayor, we tried to get a hold of the welfare. For six years, I was up there. Not one person, not one elected official, strike that, not one elected state official helped me. I had to go over to Auburn, to Mr. Brakey, and I had to go down and see Garrett Mason in order to forget to get things introduced to the legislature. This is just not right, and it's still going on. And what I'd like to see is, I'd like to see, you know, maybe it's about time we start looking at the welfare. Affair because I'm sure that's a big chunk of change right there and these poor people here you know they're struggling and what we're doing is I mean let's why don't we run the city like a city and not Ellis Island okay thank you further [1:25:31] Carl L. Sheline: Public comments Mr. Mayor, Counselor? Yes. [1:25:36] David B. Chittim: I would move to extend the public comment period beyond the initial 18 minutes and cancel the second public comment period at the end of the meeting. Okay, that's a suspension of the rules. [1:25:49] Carl L. Sheline: i 'm sorry say it again you want to suspend the rules i move to suspend the rules to allow [1:25:53] David B. Chittim: this public comment period to continue and remove the public comment period at the end [1:25:58] Carl L. Sheline: of the meeting which is designed for overflow of the initial. Yeah, so I appreciate that. I would second. Now we so Madam Clerk we have a motion to suspend the rules so that would need to be the first vote correct sure if you want to do them separately I believe the second public hearing is listed in the rules as well so we can do two separate votes if you'd like in order to vote to suspend the rules that does require a supermajority because you are changing the adopted SO YOU NEED A MINIMUM OF FIVE VOTES FOR THE MOTION TO PASS. AND IF I MAY, COUNCILORS, I APPRECIATE THIS. I THINK WE CAN ALLOW PUBLIC COMMENT AND THEN DISPENSE WITH BUREAUCRATIC THEATRICS. OR IF YOU WANT TO CONTINUE TO SUSPEND THE RULES AND GO THROUGH ALL OF THIS, WE CERTAINLY CAN. BUT I THINK PUBLIC COMMENT IS NEARLY DONE. BUT MADAM CLERK, WE HAVE A MOTION ON THE FLOOR. YOU DO. I guess I just need some clarification would you like to vote them separately one is to extend the comments right now and then the second one being to eliminate the second public hearing this evening I believe the motion was combined I guess my question was do we need to vote to suspend the rules first and then and then vote no because I believe it's all one motion you're suspending the rules to extend the comment period and suspending the rules to eliminate the second comment the fastest way we can get this done yes so We'll keep them combined as the motion was presented. Please call the vote. Councillor from Ward two? Yes. Word three? Yes. Word four? Yes. Thank you, madam. Clerk. Thank you, councillors. Yes. Further public comment. Hello. [1:28:07] Timothy Morin: Timothy Morin, Ward 4. I'd like to thank the councillors for taking my emails and I, councillor Roy, for taking my phone call. I'm glad that you guys are finally unstrapped and that you can discuss what you need to discuss as far as the reval and stuff like that. As far as my reval, I just got a recent appraisal of my home which was eighty thousand dollars less than what my reval is. So some counselors have mentioned we need to find out the process how our homes were valued. That appraisal was thorough. That gentleman came through my basement, he came through my attic, he checked around my entire home, so that was a very thorough appraisal. Nobody came to look at my home at least while I was home and they valued my home eighty thousand dollars more than a recent appraisal. So we need to get that figured out. So thank you. We see the struggle on your faces during these meetings and we appreciate that you're listening and that you're taking us seriously. So that's what the rally outside was all about. So. Thank you folks. Further. [1:29:10] Carl L. Sheline: Public comment. Public comment. More public comment. [1:29:22] Diane Chamberlain: Hi, Diane Chamberlain, Ward 2. I'm not going to take three minutes, I'm just going to say my husband and I recently retired and when we made our retirement plans we were looking at our city taxes because we knew that they would be going up through the through the hopefully 20 or so years that we're going to still be in our home before we can't be there anymore. With the with the reevaluation based on the mill rate that I have been heard is going to be thrown out, our taxes are going to go up to what I expected them to be 20. Years from now it's a 4 000 a year jump. That is just absolutely nuts. And that's what the 19 something mill rate, you would need to have the mill rate down at 11 for my Pat my taxes to stay where they are. So you really need to consider how you're going to implement this and what you're going to use for a mill rate because you're going to kick all the people of this city out and right now there's not a whole lot of good coming into this city. So you need to hold on to the people that are good and. That are. [1:30:19] Carl L. Sheline: paying their taxes thank you further public comment public comment is now closed did you yeah you beat the buzzer sir and if I may if there's anyone thing else thinking about public comment please get in line behind this good [1:30:45] David Janky: gentleman thank you my name is David janky I live and live here in Lewiston resident and I got my eval in the mail of course like everybody else I was very shocked tried to follow the process to dispute the eval not that I really dispute the value of my home what I figured out was when I did the math based on the eval letter as well as anything posted that I could find on the city website it looked like my taxes were going to be somewhere around ten thousand dollars a year going from forty eight hundred dollars so of course i had a batch of kittens right like everybody else i went through the process of scheduling a meeting with our friends down south who did the eval i sent a very nice clear letter that i've actually shared with other folks asking for certain things from them and scheduling an actual meeting it's scheduled for today my request was that I will have the meeting with you today at the time that you given me but before we have this meeting I would like to know the details of how you arrived at the number you arrived at so I will need to know what you used to reference and how you actually did it and did you show up at my property and why is my pool still in the eval and why are what buildings are you actually using for this eval I have none of that information none of it was transmitted back to me and they didn't even show up for the meeting so there was no meeting so I told them that a new meeting would be null and void unless they gave it to me by 8 a.m. this morning because my meeting was at 830 they never responded I never got anything back so as of right now my property can be that value to anything you want it to be as long as my taxes don't go to eighty six to ten thousand dollars I don't care how you get to that number what I'm asking of you is common sense the common sense is there's no reason for anybody to have their taxes double in one assessment at any point okay so it's time to play some trick I don't care if you pass it through and You bring that mill rate down to 11. All I can tell you is that all, I don't want to have to pay any that much more. I would expect four or five hundred dollars increase like everybody else probably in this room. But when you're talking thousands of dollars, I dare you to ask anybody in this room that if they would accept that, they won't, nobody will. And I'm sure none of you up there would want to do that either. Nobody's got that budget, not after taxes going, I mean gas going up, oil going up. Electricity going up, so I make good money, so is my wife, where we struggle with a couple hundred thousand dollars a year, we struggle to live in the city of that's. [1:33:50] Carl L. Sheline: Time, sir, thank you. My [1:33:55] Fred Sanborn: name is Fred Sanborn, so and I'm in Ward 6. I think one of the things you need to do is you need to sit down in Ward meetings and explain to people how the hell this happened and how exactly did they evaluate these properties. We've got some strange stories. Did they actually go out and evaluate them or did they do it on a computer and guessing? I've been to an evaluation before many years ago in Auburn and they came through the house, they measured the land, they did everything under God's creation. And we need to phase this in. We can't afford to have it hit us all at once with all the retired folks and you've heard them tonight, they can't pay these taxes. This is absolutely ridiculous. Something needs to give and we need to be honest about what the hell happened and you need to go into ward meetings and explain it to people. Thank you. Last [1:34:57] Carl L. Sheline: call for public comment, Lee. [1:35:03] Unidentified speaker (Public Commenter): Clement, Ward 6. I'll speak very briefly about the reval. We built a home here 11 years ago, we refinanced that home three years ago, had an appraisal done at that time and the value had gone up not even half of what it was. Just got the reval, our reval is better than double. Now, I understand there's a lot of moving targets out there. I've been through revals in Augusta and in the state of New Hampshire. The standard rule is about a third of your value in taxes will go up, about a third will remain the same, about a third will go down. Now, I understand there's an awful lot of moving targets in this thing. We need to know the assessment ratio. We need to know the total valuation of the city. We also need to know the budget, and that's where you folks come in. I talk to a lot of people in this city. In the last two weeks, I've talked to two professional people that are leaving the city. One made the comment, the city of Lewiston doesn't want me anymore. I've been here 60 years. They don't want me? July 1st, I'm done. I know another business owner looking to sell the business because they can't afford to stay here. We came here because my wife is a native of Lewiston and her mother was still living at the time. We thought it would be nice and we saw that Lewiston had some potential. I hate to say it, but the current administration, the elected officials of this city, are not meeting that potential and Mr. Chittum, that's life. These people that are telling me they're leaving because you can't make it affordable to live here, you need two or three things. You need affordability, you need accountability. Okay, without those two things there's no sense going any further, and we don't have those right now. That's life. I propose we ignore the chatter, yet you want to sit there and argue with corporation counsel as to who interprets the law correctly. The idea of public comment. When I was on the council, and I sat in your seat, when I was on the council, I proposed that we do away with anybody but Lewiston residents speaking. The answer that came back, we can't do that. It's public comment. You have to allow anybody from the public to speak. So I don't know whether the Corporation Council has changed their opinion of that or not. But, you know, you got to start taking things into consideration. You gotta have a little compassion up there. Ruling by edict, by fiat, just doesn't cut it anymore. I wish you people would wake up and do something right. And Mr. Mayor, I implore you, resign before it's too late. Further [1:37:52] Carl L. Sheline: public comments. My [1:37:57] Jay Roderick: name is Jay Roderick and I'm from Ward 6. My taxes actually doubled. Though if it double, I'm gonna be paying $17,000 a year for taxes on my home. You know, you're making it to the point it's impossible to live here. I own a business, you know, I'm doing, I'm doing fine here. I closed my original business here and moved in Westbrook because I knew the city is going to do this to the people. You're chasing us all the way, number one, and number one, the budget is so far out of control, that's why you can't Come up with accurate numbers, you know. Go look at Public Works. Go look at the School Department. They ask for a raise every year. They're asking for two or three raises a year. You've got to put a clamp to that. You've got to stop that. It's time to, it's time to be responsible to the people of Lewiston and to take care of our people. You know, you don't work for yourselves. You work for all of us. We control the city. We're the, we're the boss of the city, not you guys. And you guys need to take care of us. And that's not happening, you know. Mr. Mayor, all you, all you are is a yes man. I don't care what it is, you'll let anything pass. You know, the city is spending money like it's going out of style. Why? It's not your money. You don't care about how much you spend. School Department, the same way. They're spending money. No matter how much money we put in our school system, it's not a good school system. They're not teaching anybody. What you need to do before you go with the re-evaluation and get to it, get a budget down. And then you have an idea where you can tell these people how much it's going to take for them to live here. But you're not even doing that. You're worried about the value, you're trying to evaluate on a projected figure. You need to get this done, but you need to do the budget before you do re-evaluation and see where we're at. You know, start cutting the budgets down, you know, Public Works, School Department. It's time, 10% off first year, and let them start, not cut, fine, don't care how they do it, find a way to cut your budget. Even in City Hall, cut your budget. Around here, you need to cut the budget before you can make any good decisions. I've been in business a lot of years, and actually 50 years as well, as long as I've been in business, and I look at the way you guys do things, and it's not even business like. This city could run a lot better if we had more responsible people behind that chambers. What you're doing, you know, try to take care of us. That's what we're asking you for. You know, you've got to cut your budgets. And nobody seems to dare to do that. The School Department, we lay off three people. They get three principals in one school, two principals in another school. You know, and all this stuff, and you're building buildings like they're going out of style. You gave away the Police Department. [1:40:59] Carl L. Sheline: That's time, thank you. Okay, thank you. Last call for public comment. Public comment is now closed. Madam Clerk. Unders, whoa, okay, sorry, Administrator Kane, rather. We have a city administrator's report. That was a close call. [1:41:18] Bryan Kaenrath: yeah thank you first just a thank you to our public works department on earth day they cleaned up or picked up off lewiston streets 3 720 pounds of litter this is the fifth year of this effort and we've now collected over twenty two thousand seven hundred eighty pounds of litter off lewiston street so thank you to them for all their efforts on earth day a couple updates on the reval process first we do have two upcoming public sessions for the public to ask questions and have discussions with our assessing staff. The first, Monday, May 11th, 1:32:30 at the Lewiston Armory Senior Center, 65 Central Avenue. There'll be another one on Monday, May 18th, 9 to 10 a.m., also at the Armory, 65 Central Avenue. On the hearings, on the informal hearings, our Assessing Department has inquired with Tyler Tech, as we discussed at our last budget workshop, to get some information on extending the date in which to schedule one of these hearings. The cost to extend past May 15th, two weeks, will be sixty-eight thousand dollars. To extend four weeks, another hundred and thirty-one thousand dollars. So just those numbers to keep in mind. And an update as of today, we have 479 hearings scheduled. That's out of 10,503 eligible properties. It's about four percent right now. What we're being told is in typical reval situations, you can expect at least ten percent of property owners to request a hearing. So we still have a few weeks to go. We could obviously hit that ten percent or more. We'll see, but we're currently at four percent OF PROPERTY OWNERS HAVE SCHEDULED A HEARING WITH TYLER AND AGAIN FOLKS TO SCHEDULE A HEARING THEY SHOULD HAVE THEIR INFORMATION THAT WAS MELTED TO THEM ON THE FORM THE ID TYPE AND TYPE OF PROPERTY LISTED ON THE LETTER AND THEY CAN SCHEDULE THAT BY CALLING THE 800 NUMBER OR AT TYLERTECH.COM IF YOU NEED ANY OTHER ASSISTANCE OR HAVE ANY OTHER QUESTIONS PLEASE CONTACT US HERE AT CITY HALL OR ASSESSING DEPARTMENT OR EVEN ADMINISTRATION WE CAN DIRECT YOU IN THE RIGHT PLACE IF YOU'RE HAVING ISSUES WITH TYLER AS WE HEARD ONE GENTLEMAN IS AS FAR AS CUSTOMER SERVICE. PLEASE LET US KNOW ABOUT THAT AND WE'LL DO WHAT WE CAN TO HELP YOU THROUGH THE PROCESS WITH TYLER. WE WANT TO MAKE SURE EVERYONE IS OBVIOUSLY BEING SERVED HERE BY THE CITY, ALSO NOT JUST WITH OUR VENDOR, SO PLEASE GET IN TOUCH WITH US. I WANT TO THANK EVERYONE WHO CAME OUT TO OUR FIRST FOR THIS YEAR BUSKING FESTIVAL, LOUISTON LIVE ON IN DOWNTOWN LOUISTON on elizabeth street between ashe and maine. we have another date coming up this friday may 8th and a third date coming up on may 15th again 4 to 7 pm on elizabeth street. please come down, we had a great event this last week and we're hoping to keep building the momentum in the weeks ahead. so thank you to everyone involved there, a number of city staff and other partners, thank you for all of your efforts and i'm trying to make lewiston a downtown destination and a family friendly place with some good entertainment and shows. so thank you. quick update school budget validation election is tuesday may 12th. all voting will take place at the longlea school 145 birch street. you can also if there's overflow parking you need to park in the coliseum lot at 190 birch street. the lewiston public works department is working with maine d.o.t to improve main street sabata street and downtown streetscapes. now they've created design ideas to address the community's concerns and want your feedback. you can submit that feedback at lewistonmain.gov better streets please go there. we're always interested in having public feedback and making lewiston a more friendly place for everyone. memorial day we'll be having our continued tradition of events with the lewiston auburn veterans council. we invite the public to attend the memorial day observance ceremony on saturday february i'm sorry may 23rd at 10 a.m at veterans park located at main lincoln street. this year's program will honor the four chaplains and recognize the addition of nine new names on the granite monuments. like to thank jerry dewitt and everyone at the lewiston auburn veterans council for continuing to lead this meaningful tribute and we hope to see you there. lastly i just want to recognize some staff updates. we've had two retirements, billy bergeron at lewiston fire and also norman roy lewiston public works who retired hired after 37 years of service to the city. Thank you both for your long tenures. Also some of the milestones to announce, a number in the Lewiston Fire Department. We have a few that have reached 24 years of service this year, Philip, Julian, Todd LeClerc, Chris Fornier, Dennis Morin, William Wallace. All 24 years, thank you for your service to the Lewiston Fire Department. And lastly, Megan Bates at Lewiston Public Works, our Deputy Director, hit 31 years of service this year. So thank you, Megan, for all of your years of service to the city, thank you. [1:46:01] Carl L. Sheline: Thank you very much, Administrator Kinrath, for your report, and we appreciate your service to our city. Madam Clerk, I believe we have a consent agenda. Yes, there are three items on the consent agenda this evening. Item number one, orders to authorize the city administrator to alter Challenger Drive and to authorize the city administrator to release the portion of old Challenger Drive to TRE. Item number two, order authorizing the city administrator to execute a collective bargaining agreement with the American Federation of State County and Municipal Employees Council 93 on behalf of Lewiston professional technical unit local 3855 and item number three order authorizing execution of municipal quick claim deed for real estate located at 85 sleeper Road I have a motion please councillor Chittum so moved passage of all three second by councillor Harriman madam clerk please to call the vote council from word two yes word three yes word four yes word five yes word six yes word seven yes word one yes thank you council motion pass my vote of seven to zero we made it thank you item number four item number four final budget public hearing for the fiscal year 2027 municipal budget requested action to conduct a final budget public hearing to receive citizen input and communication regarding the proposed fiscal year 2027 municipal budget The public hearing for the budget is now open. If you want to talk about the city budget, please step up to the podium. If you want to talk about the school budget, that will be the next item, so you'll need to wait. [1:47:37] Matt Roy: Matt, please. Yes, thank you, Mr. Mayor. [1:47:39] Carl L. Sheline: Matt Roy, Ward 6. Mr. Roy, my apologies. Yes, thank you. [1:47:44] Matt Roy: Matt Roy, Ward 6, for the record. During tonight's workshop, you were discussing possible, well, freezing, not freezing, different positions. No, I am an avid I might have missed this but as an avid watcher I have not heard you how The council or city administration addressed the issue because of as of last Friday This new state law for the paid family medical leave is now in effect how Given potential claims. How are we going to act the city going to address that? Especially in departments that are probably more prone to emergency situations, I, you know, public safety, obviously, you know, given reports from the school department, you know, how are we going to deal with when we have people out for up to 12 weeks, replacing those employees? I have not heard that address. It's gonna be a large issue, not just for government entities, but, you know, public sector employees, especially small business, and he's especially hospital, you know, the hospitality industry, you know. The tourism, hospitality in Maine in the summer isn't mark, I don't see how these businesses aren't going to survive to actually could offer the same level of service they have historically done with this. Thank you, Matthew. [1:49:30] Carl L. Sheline: Egren, Ward 4, counselors, I ask you all to reject this current budget. I know a lot of work's gone into it, but let's be blunt, it's not sustainable. At this rate, we the taxpayers here in Lewiston are asked to pay larger and larger bills, yet are receiving less services and less results for these bills. Something has gone wrong here. I suggest a minimum of 10% off the top of the budget across the board, no department left untouched. Yes, there's going to be job losses, but we need to do something before we become the Detroit of Maine. I stood here less than six months ago and saying we needed a city public health officer. Now let me safe, we still need them, but currently it's an expense we cannot afford, and I have a suggestion for you all. We all have the rain tax. Have we seriously looked at a public safety tax, which will force all the non-profits, the hospitals, the colleges, and more to contribute a share of the cost, because they use those services too? The CMP tiff funds are being used to finance the Economic Development Department, let's put those funds back into General Fund. Agree that the city fund the department which is going to focus on what its job title is, Economic Development, and help foster real business opportunities for the city of Lewiston, which will grow our tax base as a priority. And what do you say we try to get our whole budget closer to the 2026 Social Security cost of living adjustment increase, or 2.8%? That's what our Social Security, our elderly on Social Security are going to receive this year, 2.8% increase. We are nowhere near that. I wish you guys lots of luck, but don't kick the can down the road. Make the, start making the cuts now that are going to be needed further public comment for this municipal city budget. My name is Scott Gagnon, Ward 2. It's the [1:51:56] Unidentified speaker (Public Commenter): first time I've been to a council meeting, first time I've ever actually really inquired about the city budget. For years I've lived here my whole entire life, all 50 years, except for the time I was in the army. I have never really questioned what you guys have done or are doing from budget increases, whether it's public works, public safety, whether it's education. I don't have any other choice but to come here and look at you all straight up in the face and say this is insanity. You guys have to make some tough choices. You guys were all elected to make tough choices. It is time to put your boots on, put your straps on, and make the tough calls. This is not sustainable. There's too many people, I have in-laws that have lived there their whole lives and they're like wondering how they're gonna pay for anything if the evaluations go through as they are, regardless of what you come up with for a mill rate. My personal opinion, put the evaluations through, don't wait, don't delay it, get it through, change the mill rate, fix the budget, adjust what you guys are doing. That's what you're paid, not paid but hired to do. You guys were elected to make the tough choices, make the tough choices. We don't have a never-ending back pocket. My wallet is not just open for anybody to just rate it. And that's what you guys are doing, essentially. This is not sustainable. You need to make some adjustments. You really, need to sit down with every department in the city and cut it down. And the last thing I'd say, I tried looking at the budget data on, what is it, budgetdata.net. You get some decent information in there, but it's really hard for me to look at that information and say, okay, here's where I think you can make a cut, or here's a suggestion for you to make a cut. It doesn't go deep enough. It doesn't tell me where the 24% increases in this department or what the 55% increases and over here or why the Lewis and Police Department is looking for I don't even remember what the number was. I can't really effectively look at that information and make an actual suggestion to you guys because there's nothing there for me to really pick apart. It's just a big broad number, 50 million, 20 million, 10 million, whatever that number might be, and what percentage increase that might be. That leaves me kind of just floundering. How am I supposed to help you? How am I supposed to help the city? How am I supposed to make a recommendation or even come up with an idea if I don't even know what the heck you guys are looking at? So those are my points, and I'll just leave it at that. I appreciate you guys this time tonight, and I appreciate the work that you go to put into this, but I would suggest go back to the drawing board. This is unacceptable. Thank you. Further [1:54:30] Carl L. Sheline: public comment. Public, this budget hearing is now closed. Madam clerk, we are moving up, we are now skipping ahead to item number, I think it's 16, the school department. 16, resolve approving the fiscal year 2027 budget for the Lewiston school department. Requested action to adopt the resolve approving the fiscal year 27 budget for the Lewiston school department. I have a motion. Please, so moved, Councillor Harriman, second by Councillor Chittim. We have Superintendent Lingless here to kick us off. So thank you for the opportunity tonight to share a little bit. I [1:55:18] Unidentified speaker (School Superintendent): did share a lot of information in the packet in our prior meetings as we've, we've looked at [1:55:23] Carl L. Sheline: some, if you just move the mic just a little closer to you, it's part of my goal to make you not have [1:55:27] Unidentified speaker (School Superintendent): To say it's okay, School Committee worked very hard and made some, not some, a lot of very tough decisions. The budget presented to you has 26 full-time positions reduced. There's numerous other reductions. We had some cost drivers this year that are, that are not typical, including an increase in power, which I think a lot of people feel, but we're feeling that too. Increase in workman's comp as far as that rate goes, not just a small increase, over 100 increase. We also have increases in our special education costs and programs and, but they're, they're increases that if we don't hold those programs, we will see a significant increase in cost in tuition elsewhere. The 26 positions that have been reduced was a lot of work for the School Committee to consider. They did ultimately swap some things out, put some things back, but what you have in front of you as an option, we started by cutting six and a half million and then we cut another 2.2 and the numbers that we shared earlier, it's an 8.06 percent increase on the local budget, locally 34 million dollar ask. Again, just reminding you that we've had a lot of reductions and that includes six administrative and central office in nature staff. That alone totally again over that 2.2 million dollars of reductions. These are challenging times. These are definitely very challenging times and I think that's why we try to bring a budget to you that I knew would be hard for everyone to digest, but understand that we've cut millions of dollars because we know we could not ask our community for additional funds beyond what we brought. [1:57:15] Carl L. Sheline: I'm happy to answer any questions anyone might have. Thank you, Superintendent. Yes, questions, comments from Councillors about the school budget. Councillor [1:57:25] Bret Martel: Martel. Thank you, Mr. Mayor. You said you cut a certain amount of positions. Now is that just the amount of cuts without addressing the restructuring or the adding back in of other positions, or is that, you know, one's taken out, one's put back in and you're telling us the difference of positions that are [1:57:44] Unidentified speaker (School Superintendent): Now not there. Yeah, it's a good question. So we did some things that we reduced a number of positions. For example, we have folks that work in technology that we're assisting in using modern technology, 3D printers, robotics, things of that nature, that were helping teachers facilitate those and seek the grants to get those. We've essentially reduced all of those positions, but as part of a restructuring, I think you're mentioning, we added one position. So the net of that was five reduced positions and that one position will try to get that person to wear many hats to keep some effort there with grant seeking and putting some different things in front of kids, but that's part [1:58:25] Bret Martel: of that mix. Yes, so what's the net number of positions? Just do the math. How many cut, how many going back in? I just want to know the difference. Sure, so we [1:58:34] Unidentified speaker (School Superintendent): we shared that with you, but if there's 26 reductions of people, there are additional reductions, but there were some additions. Yes, so that 26 is that net computation. At the very last meeting, they did approve to put in two sunsetting grant positions, so that factors into that as well. Thank you. [1:59:01] Carl L. Sheline: Further questions, comments from the council? Concern a gene? Yeah, I just want [1:59:06] Joshua L. Nagine: to verify really quickly, the school committee had approved this budget in a unanimous vote, is that correct? It was eight to zero. It was eight to zero. Yes. Okay, thank you. [1:59:20] Carl L. Sheline: Further comments from the council before we go to public comment? We are now, council Herriman. Yes, [1:59:27] Scott A. Harriman: thank you. Yeah, I just wanted to add that the school committee did work really hard on getting this budget down to an acceptable amount. Like the superintendent said, there were 26 net positions cut, and that's in addition to the many positions that have been cut over the last several years. Some of that is due to losing federal funds due to changing priorities at the federal level. Our schools kind of, they get funding from local funds, state funds, and federal funds, and we've lost a lot of federal funds recently, and like it was mentioned, the committee did pass this budget unanimously. There's lots of different views on the committee, and I don't think anybody got what they wanted, but we all compromised and came to a point to a final product that we could all, that we could all vote for. So I would just encourage passage tonight. [2:00:24] Carl L. Sheline: Thank you counselors, thank you superintendent. We're now having a public comment for this agenda item. If we can assemble behind Mr. Royd here just so we can move forward in an expeditious fashion, that would be great. Mr. Roy, thank you Mr. Mayor. Again, I'm at Roy, Ward Six. [2:00:46] Matt Roy: As the council, the superintendent and the school committee are aware, under EPS and the multi-page E EDU 279, the fancy spreadsheet, multi-page Excel spreadsheet that determines state subsidies. [2:01:01] Carl L. Sheline: Two things, well it's very complex, but two things. Mr. Roy, I think you need to step a little closer. [2:01:07] Matt Roy: To the mic please, for our folks at home. Is that better? Yes, there are two things that determine a two-year average from the two previous October's of our number of students enrolled and our state valuation as determined by the State Assessor's Office, you know, so the reeval, and that's a previous three-year average running. I was gonna say the school committee did mention, well there were a 50,000 foot talk among the school committee about what the re-evaluation would look like, but one thing that Wasn't really discussed is that three-year average, and as the evaluation is implemented, how that is going to affect our state subsidy, because historically our state subsidy has been over 65%, 70%, 80%. So all other things equal, not equal. And that would include the new bridge funding and how that's under LD 1228. Superintendent can correct me later with that regional, quote unquote, regional adjustment. But that will still be a factor. And of course, the school department probably is in a better place come the issue I raised with the city budget about the paid family medical leave act, given a having a well, a reserve pool century, you know, aka substitutes. Thank you. [2:02:50] Jay Roderick: Jay Roderick, Board Six. Why don't we start to consider like Pauline was doing? Pauline considered closing a school down and distribute the kids between more between the other schools we have, instead of turning around, keep us all these schools open, get rid of one and you could probably balance the budget to a pretty good budget. It'd be a lot less than what it is now, you know, instead of trying to hang on to all these schools and stuff. Paul is working on that, closing one building down and like say. distribute the kids between other buildings other schools and it would work out well you'd have less personnel you'd have less maintenance on a building you'd have less everything the expenses would be down quite a bit if you eliminated one school consider this is a very good option good evening [2:03:47] Julia Harper: my name is Julia Harper board for I also serve on the Lewiston school committee however I'm here speaking as a parent and a community member I know this is an extremely difficult budget season costs are up everywhere and this budget reflects that due to taxpayer concerns about and rising fixed costs facing the schools including electricity insurance transportation special education can crack contractual cost of living salary increases and others the school committee made the extremely difficult decision to cut 26 positions while some of these were administrators most of them were roles working directly with our students and our teachers we also use half of the district's remaining fund balance this budget reduces the initial increase in local funding requests over last year we were initially presented as a 12.39 increase and that brings it down to 8.06 but here is the real reason why this budget deserves your guests vote our schools are making real progress lewiston is one of the few districts in the state with growing enrollment which means economic opportunity as well as responsibility we have seen gains in academic achievement school culture and attendance since the pandemic because we've invested in the people who make a difference this budget keeps roles initially slated for cuts including librarians at our high school and our middle school who boost literacy and research skills, especially for our most vulnerable students. Dean and family engagement staff who keep classrooms safe and call families when elementary students miss three or more days of school, connecting them to resources so kids can return and succeed. General education social workers who are licensed clinicians who support any child regardless of insurance or ability to pay, excuse me, addressing clinical issues such as abuse, neglect and mental health. These rules are not excessive. For example, our high school has just one general education social worker with 1,500 students in a community impacted by youth gun violence. I hope voters will see these social workers as investments in school and community safety. This budget protects these roles responsibly thanks to community advocacy and for one-time state funding in the supplemental budget, while the state currently contributes close to 70% of the total cost of Lewiston's school budget. Looking ahead, there is more help. The state updated its funding formula for the first time in decades, significantly increasing funding for economically disadvantaged students, which will bring in more revenue to Lewiston schools next year. One final note for the public, a reminder that while the local tax burden is comprised of county, city, and school budgets, of these, only the fate of the school budget is decided in a referendum vote. I urge the council tonight to vote yes and let the voters decide whether or not the work we've done together balancing fiscal restraint with real investment in our youth is worth supporting on May 12th. Thank you. My [2:07:01] Bob McDonald: name is Mike Morrow, Ward 2. I think the school budget is out of whack. All I'm gonna say is repeat what this person in front of me said, the people will vote veto this budget if the school department and the city council do not make additional cuts. That's all I have to say. [2:07:25] Carl L. Sheline: Matthew Egren, Ward 4. While I appreciate the hard work that the school committee has done on this budget, much like I asked you to reject the city budget, I'd like to see another 10 taking off somewhere. It's just not sustainable to the tax base. We yes, the school does a lot of great things, it's what's hopefully going to bring new businesses in and new economic development, but we can't afford a gold-plated school for lack of a better word. And it's not a gold-plated school, it's at best stainless something plated. It's not a gold-plated school, but we can't afford as a city this increase. We're going to have a mass exodus of taxpayers who are going to put their houses on the market, they're already talking about it. I gotta give like I said, there aren't many places that the school budget has left to cut in, but a 10% across the board, which is what I've asked the city to do as well, I'm asking for the school committee. Thank you. Good [2:08:50] Sophia (Public Commenter): Evening, my name is Sophia. I am from Ward 3. I am here to urge you all to support the school Lewiston public schools budget and allow voters to decide on May 12. This budget was passed unanimously by the school committee. That matters. It reflects alignment across the people closest to our schools and to our students. Yes, this budget includes an 8.06% increase, but that increase is driven by rising fixed costs like electricity, transportation, and insurance. Even that, the district is making hard decisions, including cutting 26 positions. That is not a system asking for more without sacrifice. That is a system already stretched very thin. At the same time the school the city budget is not cutting positions so we need to be honest about where the burden is falling. This budget also uses half of the school's fund balance. That's not something you do lightly. It shows the district is trying to meet this moment without overburdening taxpayers while still protecting students. And what this budget does is protect, sorry, what this budget does protect matters. It maintains mental health supports for students eating keeps librarians and educators in place. It continues investing in programs like LRTC and lab and that are not that are working and growing. Lewiston is one of the few districts in me that is growing and we are very proud of that. We have over 5,000 students. Investment in our schools is not optional. It is an economic development. It is public safety. It is how we keep young people engaged supported and on track. We are seeing progress in academics attendance and school culture. Cutting deeper right now is undoing that progress. This vote tonight is not about approving every line item. It is about trusting the process and letting the people of Lewiston decide on May 12. I hope you can unanimously approve the budget. Thank you. [2:11:24] Kate Weber: Hello, I'm Kate Weber from Ward 2. I was thinking about the budget tonight while I was out gardening. It's a beautiful night for it. I was planting some peas and I'm hoping to save some money on food this summer with the prices of everything going up. And I had a lot of practice in this growing up in a farming family. You know they're hunting and fishing for meat growing our own vegetables saving money wherever we can. But one lesson from farming, sorry, save money, there's some things you can't save. money on if you cut on the seed on the fertilizer on that time tending the crops you're gonna be in a world of trouble later. And we're seeing the same thing right now with school. We've heard a lot from people tonight about the need for a growing tax base, for strong businesses, for skilled community leaders. We are raising those folks right now here in Lewiston schools. Our kids are the most valuable resource we have, and it doesn't make sense to try to cut their ability to grow and into the future. community and I know the school committee has worked really hard to bring the budget down and face the rising costs. They're not throwing our money around irresponsibly. Just like no one would call you irresponsible for the fact that your heating oil bill was higher this month, right, like there are costs beyond our control right now. So we're hoping to deal with that and look towards the future. So I'm asking folks tonight to please support the proposed budget and support our kids. Thank you Martin. [2:12:54] Chartrand (Public Commenter): Chartrand Ward three, you all have a lot of difficult decisions. I hope that you'll keep in mind that young people are our future and will prioritize them by voting yes on the school budget. I'm a behavioral health professional and I see every day how necessary it is for children I serve to have supportive safe and structured interactions with skilled adults. And I see how over the course of months and years working with a child can increase skills such as patience, ability to focus toward a goal. confidence in social interactions and ability to ask for what they need. As a neighbor and community member in downtown Lewiston, I see the great possibilities this community has and also its challenges. I'd ask if the 8.06 increase of the school budget sounds expensive in a time of rising costs, please remember that the children in our schools today are the same people who in coming years may be starting businesses, navigating marriage and parenthood, using drugs and alcohol, staffing our health care system, maintaining our public spaces, being charged with crimes, charging others with crimes, accessing firearms and many other things, public relations, public works, the police and many other city. Departments all work to manage our present reality. Schools are one of the few ways we can shape the future and in shape our future costs and assets the city budget you know those other departments has so far cut no positions and I it doesn't seem democratic that we all vote on the school budget but we don't get a chance to vote on the budgets of all the other departments. I'd like to see the each department prepare bear a plan A and a plan B and the voters get to decide on it if the school is gonna do that I'd like I'd rather be here talking about investing more in schools. All I'm asking today is that you help our schools maintain at least and only slightly reduced staffing level to give our youth the best chance that we can of the lives they deserve. Thank you. Hi [2:15:33] Sherry Blumenthal: my name is Sherry Blumenthal and I live in Ward 7 and I promised my daughter I would hold up the poster that she made which I didn't spoon feed her this message but I feel like she captured an important message today which is trust in our schools and you'll invest in our future and I feel like you've heard that from a number of people and as someone who's had the great privilege of living and working here for the last 20 years particularly working alongside young people I've seen that return on investment. I've seen the young people that have come through our programs stay and come back. They're here. They have kids. They have opened their own businesses. They're finance professionals or they're home health care professionals. And because I've seen that, 's one of the many things that keeps me here. And it's in large part to the schools that they were able to make it to where they are today and in the same way the schools have done their due diligence and I know you have I asked the city to go back and do their best to do more the school budget as others have said is the only part of the budget that gets voted on and if the public still feels it's untenable then you'll will know but we have an opportunity to push forward a proposal that had a lot of hard work and thought and care put in not just by committee members, but by a number of Community members who stepped in and got engaged to understand what was in front of them and what was at stake. So I ask you to continue to do the same and to move this proposal forward. So The public can vote on it on May 12th. Thank you so much [2:17:31] Carl L. Sheline: further public comment Well, the comment is now closed back to the council superintendent Langless is there anything that you'd like to address just [2:17:44] Unidentified speaker (School Superintendent): real quickly I want to talk about some growth measures we'll be sharing over the next several days some growth that we have for the first time in many areas since 2016-17 so we're proud of that I also want to share that and this isn't to pit anybody against anything but we did hear over the last few years that people do get confused that the vote or the referendum that is on May 12 is for everything and it is not it is only for the school budget and is only for the local portion of the school budget, and that is, that is that 34 million dollars, which is a 2.5 million dollar increase. School system our size, 2.5 million dollars locally, is, it's hard number to get to, it really is. So I appreciate the work of the committee and the teams that help get us to where we are, and I'll close with last night, ironically this was not planned, we had fourth, fifth, and sixth graders come to the podium and share scientific charts, data they created and collected making maple syrup in the yards of our schools. It's beautiful. It really was. [2:18:47] Carl L. Sheline: We got to support our kids. That's why we're here. Thank you, Superintendent Linglis. You know, beyond Council Herriman who serves on the school committee, I know that we have several school committee members in the audience. Thank you all for being here, as well as many staff members. So thank you all. yes, comments, questions from councilors at this time. Councilor Longchamps. [2:19:15] Susan G. Longchamps: THANK YOU MAYOR UM THANK YOU MR LANGLESS FOR BEING HERE UM WE ARE IN A VERY TOUGH TIME RIGHT NOW RIGHT OUR COUNTRY IS IN OUR STATE WITH RISING COSTS EVERYWHERE I THINK YOU guys have done a good job trimming your budget the best you could i'm not sure that it will pass on the 15th i hope it does but i'm not sure that it will this isn't really for me to vote against at this time i think that the voters have the YOU'LL HEAR THEIR OPINION, THEY'LL VOTE, AND THEY'LL HAVE THAT OPTION. I would just like to share on the city side, although we have not shared our complete budget at this time because we are still working really hard at it, but we are not just sitting back not making hard cuts too. Because we are. So for me, you know, I hope it passes. I'm not sure that it will, but I'll let the voters do that. I will vote yes tonight, and we'll let the voters decide. Thank you. [2:20:50] Carl L. Sheline: Councillor Chittim. Thank you. Mr. Mayor. [2:20:53] David B. Chittim: We've heard some impassioned pleas to support the school budget tonight. We've heard impassioned pleas to lower the tax rate tonight. You can't have it both ways. It's a very difficult position that's been said how many times I've lost track. I do believe that the schools reflect our future. This is one situation where I do believe that kicking the can down the road is the proper thing to do. If we invest today, we will see the benefits tomorrow. I've always been an advocate for funding education to the extent that we possibly can. I do believe that the school committee, the superintendent and the school committee and the staff in administration has The tools and they have done the job taking a 23 Individuals and telling them they no longer have jobs cannot be it's got to be one of the worst jobs in the world I sympathize with you completely and I echo councillor long champs concern or a statement that We're not through here at the council level either it is a very tough choice my email has been running about 50-50 support the schools lower the taxes support the schools lower the taxes. I'm going to fall back on my own personal preference and that is that I will support the schools. I urge people who are supporting this budget when supporting the education system to get out and vote. This referendum question has historically been an exceedingly low turnout, so I would urge you if you are in favor of the school budget please express that at the polls. I'm not trying to disenfranchise those folks who want to lower their taxes, they're invited to vote as well but it's especially important to me that folks who are supporting the work that the school department has done and the school committee get out and express that appreciation on May 12th. So thank you superintendent for the work that you've done, it's a thankless job and a [2:22:53] Carl L. Sheline: merciless job but I appreciate it very much. Thank you. Councilor Roy. Thank you Mr. Mayor. [2:23:03] Michael R. Roy: Thank you superintendent and thank you for all of you that come out and support the school budget. When I ran I ran on education and I believe education is very important for our community. You know to echo the counselors that are up here today and what they've said, it is very hard to make this decision but for me I feel it's not because we need to support our schools, we need to support our youth. I also want to say I am full, I'm in full support and I don't know how to make this happen, and I've said this before in our budget. I would like the citizens of Lewiston to vote on the city budget. I really wish that would happen. Because again, I think, you know, we need to hear more input from everybody. And I would really like that. And again, if we need, I wish there was a way, if people do not like the budget, let's make it a point to figure out why they don't like the budget and what they would cut. Like I would really love to know that information because that way there it would make it easier for all the people to make those decisions and make those cuts and where they need to be cut but I will I'll be voting in support of the school budget tonight thank you further [2:24:28] Carl L. Sheline: Comments from Councillor [2:24:31] Bret Martel: Martell yes Thank You Mr. Mayor and thank you Superintendent for being here I also want to thank all your staff and all the teachers and everyone in our schools that work as hard as they can to do the best job they can I am going to say some critical things so I want to make sure that appreciation is laid out and understood I'm looking at objective measurable academic metrics that tell a story that makes it very difficult when the words trust our schools come out because Main wide I'm looking at a graph that says Between 2013 and 2024 spending grew 71 percent in the state of Maine to over 21 000 per student that drastically outpaced inflation during that same time fourth and eighth grade reading and math test scores actually consistently got worse eighth grade math scores did level off in 2024 but reading scores have continued to plummet so I struggle to find the correlation between more money resulting in better results for our students I don't happen to think that the money is the issue I happen to Think the way that it's being spent and the way that education is been adopted and changed over the years it seems to it actually seems a negative correlation that the more money we put into school systems statewide actually produce worse measurable academic results that is not my opinion that is objective truth and it's unfortunate so I struggle to think that continuing to set record-setting school budgets year after year after year has benefited our students in any way and this isn't a dig at any teacher or administrator or counselor or coach it is just a fact of the matter that I'm looking at and it is getting more and more expensive every year to really do a substandard job at educating our children. Maine used to rank nearly top of the nation in school rankings. Maine is now near the bottom and Lewiston ranks near the bottom in one of the worst ranked states. And I think it would be disingenuous to not point that out. I will be voting against this budget tonight because I was re-watching tonight a school committee meeting that I watched a few weeks ago where multiple members of the school committee in open meeting discussed that they should preserve cuts that I they pretty much acknowledged should be made. They acknowledge that they did not think that this would pass referendum. And so I'm paraphrasing very much here but it sounded like let's wait until they kick the first one back anyway so then we can make these cuts. It almost feels performative. We're trying to appease upset tax base that is just having their pockets reached into over and over again. So acknowledging the fact that it costs the city money to continually host these referendums when these school budgets do get voted down which happened I want to say three or four times just a couple years ago that can be costly as well. So what I think we should see is a little sharpening of the pencil in making the cuts that I think have been acknowledged are going to be required to get this to pass referendum beforehand so we don't need to have any additional elections that aren't necessary and incur any additional costs. I happen I think having those types of dialogue and discussion and open meeting is disingenuous to the taxpayer. It's openly saying that we know we know more cuts are going to be required we're just going to wait and save them for a later date. So for those reasons in those admissions I will be voting against this budget because I also do believe that while this budget was passed unanimously out of school committee I happen to know at least one school committee member who also believes that this is going to get kicked back. So I think it's time to get real about the cuts and I hate I hate to say this but it shouldn't be so expensive to objectively we've got 25 percent of fourth and eighth grade students that can read and do math at grade level in the state of Maine which means three out of four kids can't. I consider that a bit of a failure and I don't think it Should be so expensive to reach or to fail to reach better goals or better rankings or better test scores. So I don't expect that these comments will make me very popular with the school committee, but I think that these are objective truths that are worth pointing out and that are going to need to be addressed, because the budget sets a new record every single year and I don't see any correlation and improvement in test scores or graduation rates. Thank you. [2:30:00] Joshua L. Nagine: Further comments, questions from Counselor Naging? Yes, so thank you Mr. Mayor, thank you Superintendent. I just want to go over a couple of things that I think is very challenging for all of us right now. One of those is that the school budget referendum happens on the 12th, the final budget for the city won't be approved until the 19th, and then also we have growing enrollment, which is good, we haven't had an expanding tax base, which is challenging, and so many of the things that we're looking at, it's it's a Schrodinger's cat for an expanding tax base is like, is it gonna happen, is it not going to happen, because that's the only thing that's going to save us at this point. And unfortunately when we start to cut things to a point where those essential services don't actually function correctly, it's a death spiral. The results for minimal cuts return maximal damages. I would simply say that due to the fact that the school committee voted unanimously to support this budget, I would also vote to support this budget since it does go to referendum. I do think that you're going to find the challenge in getting it passed in referendum and that's, that's all I have to council. [2:31:28] Carl L. Sheline: Roy, back to you. [2:31:30] Michael R. Roy: Thank you Mr. Mayor. One of the things I want to say that I just thought about, when you continuously cut and got a school budget, what do you get? That's all I'm gonna ask. Thank [2:31:51] Carl L. Sheline: you councillors. Anything further, Superintendent Language? I understand that you made cuts before was presented to the school budget, is that I or before you presented to school committee, is [2:32:03] Unidentified speaker (School Superintendent): that accurate, significant reductions before the committee even got my version? [2:32:07] Carl L. Sheline: of the budget and then the committee made reduction further reductions after that is that accurate it's correct yeah I understand that you've made hard decisions and i understand it's also a hard decision to pass this budget in the light of you know everything that we have heard this evening this is absolutely an investment in our future and i urge the council to pass this i urge the citizens to vote for this to on the 15th as well madam clerk or councillor longchamps there's something you'd [2:32:41] Susan G. Longchamps: like to add yes thank you mayor could you share with the public and i'd like to know too i know there were some recent changes to the budget exactly how much you have taken off from your original proposal the [2:32:58] Unidentified speaker (School Superintendent): the proposed reductions that we had equaled 2.209 135 so 2.2 million dollars in additional reductions after the reductions that to be honest weren't even been made public i have a team of administrators that trust that work hard for our kids that said we really need this we really need this we really need this and i said duly noted we cannot add to this budget in this way we're not going to be able to do that it's not real in our community and i think of the people that are struggling to make ends meet looking at inflation across the board and so that was that's that's the total reduction number i have from my latest sheet THAT I PRESENTED TO THE SCHOOL COMMITTEE WAS 2.209 MILLION DOLLARS IN ADDITIONAL REDUCTIONS [2:33:43] Susan G. Longchamps: THANK YOU MADAM [2:33:47] Carl L. Sheline: CLERK PLEASE CALL THE VOTE COUNSELOR FROM WORD TWO YES WORD THREE YES WORD FOUR YES WORD FIVE YES WORD SIX YES WORD SEVEN NO WORD ONE YES MOTION PASSED BY VOTE OF 61. THANK YOU SUPERINTENDENT THANK YOU FOR BEING HERE AND THANK YOU TO EVERYONE WHO SPOKE DURING public comment we'll see you at the polls madam clerk we're gonna take just like a three minute recess to allow people who wish to leave to do so and then we'll pick back up we'll be we'll be back in three to five minutes i was gonna say and we're back thank you everyone for their patience madam clerk i believe we're back to item number five is that Correct. Yes sir, item number five, public hearing for approval of an outdoor entertainment permit for Great Falls Pride. Requested action to conduct a public hearing on an application for an outdoor entertainment event for the Great Falls Pride event and to grant a permit for an outdoor entertainment event as required by the City Code of Ordinances chapter 10 article 1 section 10-3 to the Great Falls Pride organization for outdoor music concerts for the festival to be held at Samard Payne Memorial Park on June 7th contingent upon positive recommendations from the police department, fire department, code health officer, and land use inspector regarding compliance with all regulations and compliance with all city ordinances. I'm have a motion. Please so move councillors. Second thing by councillor named Jean. Discussion among the council. Councillor Chinum, yes, a general question is this public hearing required by state law or city ordinance? Thank you. Public comment for this agenda item. Back to the council. Fully support this and madam clerk please vote or please call the vote. Council number two yes, word three yes, word four yes, word five yes, word six yes, word seven yes, seven to zero. I'm number six, item number six, public hearing for approval of an outdoor entertainment permit for Great Falls Brewfest. Requested action to conduct a public hearing on an application for an outdoor entertainment event for the Great Falls Brewfest and to grant a permit for an outdoor entertainment event as required by the City Code of Ordinances chapter 10 article 1 section 10-3 to Baxter Brewing Company for outdoor music for the event to be held at Samaritaine Memorial Park on June 25th through 28th contingent upon positive recommendations from the police department, fire department, code health officer, and land use inspector regarding compliance with law regulations and compliance with all city ordinances. We have a motion to move counselor. Second by councillor Nageen, yes. Discussion. Public comment. Back to the council. Councillor Chittim, yes, I noticed that beverages are [2:42:44] David B. Chittim: available but it doesn't indicate whether they're going to be given away, in which case I'll be there, [2:42:48] Carl L. Sheline: or sold, in which case I'll probably be there too. You need to buy a ticket counselor. [2:42:54] Joshua L. Nagine: Naging, I can answer that for you. To get in you have to buy a ticket and then the beverages are free as long as you're over 21. [2:43:05] Carl L. Sheline: Madam Clark please call the vote. That's it from where two. Yes, word three. Yes, word four. Yes, word five. Yes, word six. Yes, word seven. Yes, I'm number seven. Number seven, public hearing for approval of an outdoor entertainment permit for Art Walk. Requested action to conduct a public hearing on an application for an outdoor entertainment event for the Art Walk and to grant a permit for an outdoor entertainment event as required by the City Code of Ordinances Chapter 10, Article 1, Section 10-3 to LA Arts for outdoor music for the event to be held along Lisbon Street and at Dufresne Plaza on May 29th, June 26, July 31st, August 28th, and September 25th, contingent upon positive recommendations from the police department, fire department, code health officer, and land use inspector regarding compliance WITH ALL REGULATIONS AND COMPLIANCE WITH ALL CITY ORDINANCES. CAN I HAVE A MOTION, PLEASE? SO MOVED. COUNCILOR CHIDDOM. SECOND. SECONDED BY COUNCILOR NAJING. DISCUSSION? PUBLIC COMMENT? BACK TO THE COUNCIL. MADAM CLERK, PLEASE CALL THE VOTE. COUNCILOR, FROM WORD TWO? YES. WORD THREE? YES. WORD FOUR? YES. WORD FIVE? YES. WORD SIX? YES. WORD SEVEN? YES. YES. OOPS, SORRY. MY APOLOGIES. Motion to pass with a vote of 7-0. Madam Clerk, did you get all the votes? I did, yes. Excellent. So happy that you're here. Item number 8. Item number 8, public hearing for approval of an outdoor entertainment permit for Last Chance MC Clean and Sober Cookout. Requested action to conduct a public hearing on an application for an outdoor entertainment event for the Last Chance MC Clean and Sober Cookout and to grant a permit for an outdoor entertainment event as required by the City Code of Ordinances Chapter 10, Article 1, Section 10-3. Last Chance MC Central Maine for outdoor music for the event to be held at Kennedy Park on June 20th, contingent upon positive recommendations from the police department, fire department, code health officer, and land use inspector regarding compliance with all regulations and compliance with all city ordinances. No moved, Councillors. Second thing by Councillor Nei Jean. Discussion. Public comment. Back to the council, Madam Clerk. please call the vote council from word two yes word three yes word four yes word five yes word six yes word seven yes board one yes motion passed a vote of seven to zero i'm number nine number nine public hearing for approval of an outdoor entertainment permit for summer fun and films requested action to conduct a public hearing on an application for an outdoor entertainment event for the summer fun and films and to grant a permit for an outdoor entertainment event as required by the city code of ordinances article 10 section 1 section 10-3 to Summer Fun and Films organization for outdoor music for the event to be held at Samar Pain Park and Pettengill Park on June 24th, July 8th, July 22nd, August 4th, and August 19th, contingent upon positive recommendations from the police department, fire department, code, health officer, and land use inspector regarding compliance with law regulations and compliance with all city I have a motion please. I'll move. Councilor Chittenden. Second by Councilor Nagine. Discussion? Public comment? Part of the council? Madam Clerk please call the vote. Council for word two? Yes. Word three? Yes. Word four? Yes. Word five? Yes. Word six? Yes. Word seven? Yes. Word one? Yes. We're now up to item number 10. Item 10, public hearing and final passage for an amendment to the zoning and land use code article 11 district regulations for changes to the space and bulk table and the land use table regarding mobile homes, daycares, and used car dealers, and new dimensional requirements. Requested action that the proposed amendments to appendix A of the code of ordinances zoning and land use code article 11 district regulations regarding mobile homes, daycares, and used car dealers, and new dimensional requirements receive final passage by a roll call vote i have a motion please so move counselor chittum second signed by counselor nageen director connor thank you very much for being here i'll let you kick us off just here for any additional [2:47:09] Bryan Kaenrath: questions that the council may have for this agenda item. Again, just a reminder, it was originally brought to the council at the best of the planning board. There was an item in there I believe it had to do with the minimum or maximum heights in NCB. The council voted it down. We brought it back to the planning board. They removed it, brought all of the other language that you guys all approved unanimously back to the council. So happy to have answer any questions that you may have. [2:47:34] Carl L. Sheline: Thank you very much discussion public comment back to the council madam clerk please vote or please madam clerk please call the votes council from word. Two yes word three yes word four yes word five yes word six yes word seven yes word one yes thank you very much I'm number 11. Number 11 public hearing and final passage to contractually rezone 860 Lisbon Street from the neighborhood business zoning district to a contract zone to allow the commercial uses and bulk and space requirements for the community business district with the exception of smaller setbacks for pavement and structures requested action that the proposed amendments to appendix A of the code of ordinances zoning and land use code article 4 establishment of districts for a contract zone located at 860 Lisbon Street from neighborhood business excuse me zoning district to a contract zone with the limitations proposed receive final Passage by a roll call vote I have a motion please I'll move counselor second by Councilor Najing Director Conner please kick us off again happy to answer any additional questions [2:48:44] Bryan Kaenrath: That the council may have and again we have a member of a representative from LHA in the audience if the council has any further questions [2:48:54] Joshua L. Nagine: Yes Councilor Najing just checking on when the shovel is going to go on the ground good [2:49:07] Unidentified speaker (LHA Representative): Evening everyone when I was here two weeks ago my estimate was six to eight weeks for closing I still feel confident that we're in the four to six week range for a closing we don't have a closing date set yet but we have had multiple closing calls with Main Housing and all the other representatives for the transaction so all good signs thank you [2:49:30] Carl L. Sheline: Welcome to that and council I don't mind telling you that I had a conversation with Dan Brennan and we are approaching the finish line further questions comments public comment. [2:49:54] Carl L. Sheline: Hello, counselors. You know, we keep getting told this project is funded. It's ready to go. We'll be breaking ground soon. We were supposed to break ground in February. In April. Now we're in June. You know, and now they want to add commercial aspect to this property. WASN'T THE PLANNED PROJECT already designed with it just being a senior housing for our seniors that we desperately need? How does this new business opportunity affect traffic in that area? Will it make it safer? Will it make it worse? Will there be more accidents right there? It seems more like a bait-and-switch operation now because they keep delaying breaking ground. We've all heard them say we'll be breaking ground this year. I may be eligible for senior housing by the time that project gets broken. Let's compare that to the Gendron's project. They're already putting buildings up, started just about the same time. To me it almost seems like Lewis and Housing is trying to run out the clock on their on this property so that the city will buy that property back. They already have the plans. They theoretically have told us multiple times they've already had the funding secured. Let's get them building. I understand them wanting this height increase to include more space but the setback to five feet from the property line, that's less than what the school had there. I would rather see this just go up as a simple senior project which has been promised to us multiple times by Lewiston Housing. They have it funded. Let's not change it to a commercial zone. LET'S BUILD IT AS HOUSING AND HOUSING NOW NOT SIX YEARS FROM NOW WHICH IS WHAT IT SEEMS LIKE THIS PROJECT'S GOING TO BE. WE WERE SUPPOSED TO BUILD LAST YEAR. I'M PROBABLY SURE WE'RE SUPPOSED TO BUILD THE YEAR BEFORE THAT BUT YOU KNOW JUST TELL THEM TO BUILD. DON'T CHANGE ANYTHING. THEY ALREADY HAVE THE PLANS BECAUSE NOW THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE TO CHANGE THEIR PLANNING building further public comments back to the council. Anything further? Door to Connor? I'm sorry, wait, nope. Okay, all right. Please call vote. Yes,, I'm number 12, number 12, public hearing an MOVED. SECOND. COUNSELOR CHIDDOM. SECOND BY COUNSELOR NAGING. DIRECTOR. OH, THERE WE GO. MANAGER RUTH. I FOUND YOU. IS THERE ANYTHING THAT YOU WOULD LIKE TO SAY? OKAY. OKAY. QUESTIONS, COMMENTS FROM THE COUNCIL? PUBLIC COMMENT. [2:53:50] Matt Roy: I'M AT ROY WARD SIX. IT'S A MISNOMER TO QUOTE FEDERAL FISCAL YEAR 26 WHEN THAT EXPIRES SEPTEMBER 30TH OF THIS YEAR SO IT'S NOT THIS GREAT PANCEA THAT THE CITY FISCAL YEAR USES A DIFFERENT NUMBERING SYSTEM. THE FEDERAL FISCAL YEAR 26 ENDS THREE MONTHS INTO OUR 27 FISCAL YEAR SO UH MAKE THIS IN THE NEXT AGENDA ITEM MAKE NO LOGICAL SENSE HOW THE FISCAL YEARS ARE STRUCTURED. THANK YOU. FURTHER [2:54:26] Carl L. Sheline: PUBLIC COMMENT BACK TO [2:54:29] Ruth (Community Development Manager): US QUESTIONS COMMENTS FOR MANAGER RUTH. YES, THANK YOU CATHERINE RUTH, COMMUNITY DEVELOPMENT MANAGER. COMMUNITY DEVELOPMENT MANAGER, WE HAVE BEEN REQUESTED BY HUD TO LIST THIS ON THE AGENDA, AND SO WE HAVE DONE SO. THANK YOU. [2:54:46] Joshua L. Nagine: Oh yes, of course, Kelsey. And agent, what do you hope? I just wanted to just quickly thank Manager Ruth and the CAC council for the work on this. For anybody listening at home or reading the packet, the way this works is we're actually given an allocation from the federal government. This doesn't come from the tax base, and we're required to spend it in particular ways, including supporting local community organizations. So when you see the breakdowns of where that money goes and why it goes that way and where it goes, that is a, that is an allocation that's set by federal guidelines. There's not a lot of moving around for us. It's just a question of the presentations that are put in front of us for funding requests and the scoring system in which we use as members of the CAC in order to get that through. So again, it does hit the tax base somewhere because it's federal fund funding, but it's not coming from the general funds, and it is a limited pot of money that is specifically to be spent on, specific programs. We don't have the option of switching this money into, like, we couldn't put it into the general fund, for instance, which in a year like this wouldn't be a bad idea, but just wanted to [2:56:05] Carl L. Sheline: I'll point that out. I also appreciate the CDBG committee for serving and helping Manager Ruth through all of this. Further questions, comments from the council? Anything further, Manager Ruth? [2:56:19] Ruth (Community Development Manager): No, we're all set, thank you. [2:56:20] Carl L. Sheline: Madam Clerk, please call the vote. Councilor, from word two? Yes. Word three? Yes. Word four? Yes. Word five? Yes. Word six? Yes. Word seven? Yes. Word one? Yes. Pass by vote of seven to zero. Adoption of resolve approving the city fiscal year 27 federal fiscal year 2026 home budget and action plan for submittal to the U.S. Department of Housing and Urban Development. Requested action to conduct a public hearing and adopt the order approving the city fiscal year 27 federal fiscal year 2026 home budget and action plan for submittal to the U.S. Department of Housing and Urban Development. I have a motion, please, so move. Councilor Chittim, second. Second. Seconded by Councillor Nagy and Manager Ruth. Is there anything you'd like to say? [2:57:05] Ruth (Community Development Manager): No, we're all set, thank you. [2:57:06] Carl L. Sheline: Okay, questions, comments from the council? Public comment for this. Back to the council. Madam Clerk, please call the vote. Council, from word two? Yes. Word three? Yes. Word four? Yes. Word five? Yes. Word six? Yes. Word seven? Yes. Word one? Yes. Motion passed with a vote of seven to zero. Moving right along here, item number 14. Item number 14, public hearing and adoption of order approving the Lewiston CDBG 2026-2030 community development block grant consolidated five-year plan and it's submittal to the US Department of Housing and Urban Development requested action to conduct a public hearing and adopt the order approving the Lewiston CDBG 2026-2030 community development block grant consolidated five-year plan and it's submittal to the US Department of Housing and Urban Development. May I have a motion please? So moved. Councillor Chittim seconded by Councillor Nagy. Anything you'd like to say [2:57:58] Ruth (Community Development Manager): Manager Ruth yes thank you very much this is a very important plan for the city of Lewiston it's a five-year plan that needs to be submitted in May we are on a one-year extension we've been on extensions since about 2020 on a variety of projects and so this summer all of our extension projects will all be completed up to date and then we'll be back on track on the HUD schedule of when items are supposed to be done we'll have done two different types of grant projects and plans in one year but We'll be caught up so this is a plan that talks about what's going to take place for the next five years based upon the current budget and from the amazing support that we've seen across the country for cdgb funds we do expect there will be funding in the future. We're going to be concentrating on the same goals that we had in the prior plan. They're all very relevant because we won't be spending catch-up for the last year to get everything up to date. We'll have more time to really focus on the projects and work with the public service agencies who are doing a wonderful job and very accountable to the city. We'll be focusing on poverty, as well as economic opportunities, public facilities, and especially the essential public services that are needed to improve the quality of life for people. The entire plan is in this box here, it's kind of crazy, the HUD reporting system and everything they do. You have the executive summary, which is what you've always voted on in the past. [2:59:44] Carl L. Sheline: You thank you questions comments Councilor Chittim yes thank you very much and congratulations on [2:59:50] David B. Chittim: Getting up to getting the schedule back on track again, that must seem like a huge accomplishment. Congratulations to you and all the folks that made that happen. Thank you. Public comment for this [3:00:01] Carl L. Sheline: agenda item back to the council. Councillor Nagine, yes, I would just like to echo that. [3:00:08] Joshua L. Nagine: Thank you, Manager Ruth, for your diligent work and getting us all up to date on all of our reporting requirements and all of these pieces. It's super important. Thank [3:00:22] Ruth (Community Development Manager): you. Yes, thank you. It'll be good to work on actual projects now. We are honored by [3:00:29] Carl L. Sheline: your service. Thank you. Madam Clerk, please call the vote. Yes, I'm number 15. under 15 public hearing and adoption of order authorizing an amendment to the 731 thousand eight hundred ninety seven dollar cdbg cv cares act budget to add a project to the category provide essential services public services and public facilities infrastructure requested action to conduct a public hearing and adopt the order authorizing an amendment to the seven hundred and thirty one thousand eight hundred ninety seven dollar cdbgcb cares act budget to add a project to the category provide essential services, public services and public facilities infrastructure. I have a motion. Please, so moved, Councilor. I'm saying by Councillor Nai Jean. Manager Ruth, yes. [3:01:28] Ruth (Community Development Manager): Very quickly, we started working on this grant earlier this year and HUD had indicated some of the projects that we had submitted for it just wouldn't fit and there were a lot of projects that other communities had submitted to spend the remaining funds that we didn't feel comfortable sending in. So in working with our project manager, we found that because we have an open project at Sunnyside Park and that project has bids out and quotes and an environmental review that's a general in nature that funding that is still available in this grant that will expire on June 18th, we did receive an approval. 2 weeks ago that we could proceed forward and that would be a $132,315 that can be spent on Sunday side park or another park if by some miracle like I could find a park in the for census tracts that we could do an environmental review for in well the few days that we would have left. So I think we'll concentrate on Sunnyside Park. We have playground equipment that's out to bed for almost $69,000 so that will use some of the money and we have gone up to the park numerous weekends and see people Standing around, there's no place for them to set. It's a park that needs some work, so there's a lot of projects that we can do there to spend the remaining 73,000. And so we've met with public works and everybody's very excited that we got approved to go forward, and we have to have all our bills through the expense war on June 18th. So this will be a all hands on deck all day long project. Thank you. [3:03:18] Joshua L. Nagine: It exciting times, thank you Councillor Nagine. So just really quickly, this is cares act funding that we received in 2020 for projects that we didn't complete, and so I just want to point this out to the council as well. There's a hundred thousand dollar request in the LCIP for Sunnyside Park. I'm hoping that this funding here would supplement that, would actually allow us to remove that $100,000 from Sunnyside Park, although I would request that we leave a $25,000 LCIP request for traffic calming measures on Ware and Mountain Ave, which I can tell you that every single person who lives on Ware and Mountain and the connecting roads have asked for basically speed bumps. So point being, we're going to be removing the $100,000 from the LCIP as long as everybody agrees and we found money that we can spend on it, [3:04:19] Carl L. Sheline: public comment back to the council, councilor [3:04:24] David B. Chittim: Chiddom, yeah, I just want to recognize Councilor Najean. He's been indefatigable in supporting and arguing and championing improvements to Sunny Side Park in addition to the remainder of his award. So he's he's a he's a model. I appreciate your efforts, councilor. I'm more than happy to support. Thank [3:04:46] Carl L. Sheline: YOU, COUNSELOR NAGY. MADAM CLERK, PLEASE CALL THE VOTE. COUNSELOR, FROM WORD TWO? YES. WORD THREE? YES. WORD FOUR? YES. WORD FIVE? YES. WORD SIX? YES. WORD SEVEN? YES. WORD ONE? YES. MOTION PASS BY VOTE OF 7-0. We have done 16, so we're moving to 17. Administration 17, receipt of the Finance Committee's recommendation regarding the proposed fiscal year 2027 municipal budget. Requested action to receive and review the recommendation from the Finance Committee regarding the proposed fiscal year 2027 municipal budget. Thank you madam clerk, I think we have the chair here from the Finance Committee. You do [3:05:27] David B. Chittim: and yeah, it also happens to be the author of the letter, so wow [3:05:30] Carl L. Sheline: lucky us, extremely. Please continue, sir. You've all read the letter, I'm happy to [3:05:38] David B. Chittim: Answer any questions. The finance committee takes very seriously its charge to recommend action or consideration of its recommendations on the budget. We are all deeply involved in the budget, so this is another piece to add to it. I'd be happy to answer any questions that people may [3:05:58] Carl L. Sheline: have about this recommendation. Questions for the finance chair? Public comment for this agenda item? Back to the council, we're simply receiving it, so there's no vote. Thank you so much for authoring this letter and for your service as finance chair. We have voted out the second public comment period. We're now up to reports and updates from councillors, should there be any. We're now up to new business, should [3:06:36] Michael R. Roy: there be any. Counselor? Counselor Roy? Yes, thank you, Mr. Mayor. Earlier tonight we heard from a lot of citizens, or actually over the last multiple weeks we've heard from a lot of citizens through email and or maybe social media. Do we have a system in Lewiston like, if there is, I know like the superintendent and the school system sends out a bulletin that says hey active shooter, or you know, hey you know here's a warning or whatever. Do we have a system in Lewiston that all the taxpayers could have like, because I know if you, if you have children in the school system you get texts from the superintendent in the schools, if you have something from Lewiston about parking bans and all that stuff you may get something, but I have the parking BAN ONE BUT I DIDN'T KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT AN ACTIVE SHOOTER OR ANYTHING LIKE THIS. I DON'T GET ANY UPDATES LIKE THAT. SO WHAT I'M ASKING FOR IS, CAN WE, IS THERE A SYSTEM THAT WE HAVE IN LOUISTON THAT WE CAN NOTIFY THE TAXPAYERS OF SOMETHING LIKE THAT GOING ON LIKE A SHELTER IN PLACE, A WATER MAIN BREAK, YOU KNOW, BECAUSE AGAIN TO GET THESE THINGS OUT FASTER SO THAT PEOPLE DON'T CONSUME THE WATER, people don't go in areas. [3:07:59] Carl L. Sheline: That's what I wanted. Mr. Kainrath, do you want to take that? [3:08:03] Bryan Kaenrath: Yeah, so if you're asking about sort of a text specific thing we have, we do have notify me. It's a subscription service. You can subscribe to many different categories of what sort of awards you'd like to receive. For example, there's one about, you know, council meetings and city meetings. So there are a number of different categories. I believe there is an option to take everyone subscribed in those all the categories and send something out. It certainly does not cover all taxpayers laws you're talking about because it requires them to sign up. You know, of course, you know, in events like this, things are being posted on social media, things are being sent to the media, various media forms, but I think what you're asking about specifically is from a direct sort of text type of system, which we do have, but it requires them to sign up. Also and [3:08:49] Michael R. Roy: I'm just thinking about our older population in Lewiston, right, who don't use social media or who may not, you know, text numbers or whatever rate, so I in a perfect world, I wish we could get everybody, but the majority of the people I would like to reach, so those are long drams. [3:09:08] Susan G. Longchamps: Thank you, Mayor. I think it's a difficult task, to ask for only because, for instance, we thought there was an active shooter, but there actually wasn't. This gentleman didn't even have a firearm, so if you start panicking people, that's that's that's more troubling and more traumatizing. I believe that our police department does a really good job putting out information when it's needed. Do they put out every time there is a threat or a scare that someone may have a gun? No, and that's for lots of reasons. One in particular is, it true? Do they really have a gun? So until they really apprehend that person or really have facts, they really can't share that because then what you're doing is you're traumatizing a whole city that has already been traumatized by gun violence, so although I love the thought, I just don't think it would really be beneficial to have some sort of system where everybody gets alerted because it's just not always true. I mean, a school went down in lockdown or two schools, Bates College and the middle school or the high school in our hospital, but that's something that they chose to do as a precaution, which there's nothing wrong with that, but they were they were not asked to do that from the city or the police department because no one really had facts on what was going on at [3:10:50] Scott A. Harriman: That time, thank you. Counselor Herman, thank you. I'd ask that the city that we use our texting and email platforms more. Some of the recent incidents that have happened, I was kept up to date quite well by the school department with texts and emails. It seems like the city often only uses social media or and or TV, and for myself, I don't use social media very much and I don't watch TV, so I would prefer if it would be great if we could cover all of those channels, but the channels that most people have like text messages and emails, that I feel like that would be more effective because I've been I've been kept up to date by the school department a lot more than the city recently. Back [3:11:43] Michael R. Roy: to you, Councillor Roy. Thank you. And I wasn't just so everybody knows, I wasn't calling out the police department, but what concerns me a lot with this is like the water main break, right? So there were a lot of people that didn't know that they probably should have boiled their water first. There's a lot of businesses that didn't know, so that's why I'm saying, you know, if we could get the bigger things out there, right, the ones that we know to be true in nature, right, I'll rephrase it that way. So [3:12:13] Joshua L. Nagine: further, yes, Counselor Aging. So just really quickly, I'm gonna speak for our city clerk, I think, but on the 16th of May we have the flag placement for Memorial Day at both Riverside Cemetery and St. Peter's Cemetery. We're looking for volunteers for both. This also happens to coincide with planned Sunnyside Park and River walk cleanup that's going to be scheduled for the 16th just a little bit afterwards, so if you're in the neighborhood and you've got nothing to do, put up some flags for the veterans for sure and come pick up some trash. I'd also like to point out that there are 14 vacancies on committees in our city, including our Public Safety Committee, that I think is pressing and we need to get staff of volunteers as quickly as we possibly can. And I just want to quickly also highlight the fact that as we're going through this budget season, things are I think exceedingly difficult, and there will absolutely have cuts that we have to make, and I'm not quite sure if that's going to be acceptable to certain, no matter what cuts we make it may not be acceptable to certain segments of our community. We have people on fixed incomes who do not have the money to pay no matter what we're Talking about for the budget, those are hard things we have foot. The middle class is shrinking right now all across the country. The economy is horrendous, you know, the working like we've got layoffs happening all over the place, you know. This is it's a really bad environment right now, and I guess the point that I'm trying to illustrate there is that even in this challenging environment, we absolutely have to increase our tax base. We need to desperately, we need good paying jobs brought into the city. We need more taxpayers contributing to what is it essentially essential services. What we're looking at right now, the more cuts we make, eventually what will happen is we get a diminishing return on investment. We'll have failing services in our community, and that's when people talk about Detroit, that's Detroit. So let's not end up there, and that's it, that's all I want to say. Are we ready to head to [3:14:48] Carl L. Sheline: executive session, counselors? Appears to be so. Madam Clerk, we have two executive sessions we're heading to. Yes sir, items number 21 and 22. Number 21, executive session pursuant to Main Revised Statutes Annotated Title 1 Section 4056c to discuss an economic development issue of which pursuant to Main Revised Statutes Annotated Title 1 Section 405 6a to discuss the personnel matter. May have a motion, please. Move to approve both. Councilor. Second by Councilor Neigean. Madam Clerk, please call the vote. That's a from word two yes, word three yes, word four yes, word five yes, word six yes, word seven yes, word one yes. Thank you, Louison. Thank you to everyone who came out tonight. Have a wonderful evening.