Sagadahoc County tables opioid fund decision, discusses jail and tower updates

[0:08] Chair: There it is. Good afternoon. This is the regular monthly meeting of the Sagatahaw County Commissioners. It's Tuesday, October 13. Quorum being present, I'll call the meeting to order. Any public comments? Seeing none. [0:28] Commissioner: Amendments to the agenda? No amendment, but I do have one comment that I forgot to share with you that Bill was going to ask you to share, if that's okay. Okay. Okay. [0:38] Chair: Let me put that together. [0:41] Commissioner: There's going to be a public meeting on October 28th to review the hazard mitigation plan, and we're going to email the commissioners a copy for their review also. Okay. Okay. [0:56] Chair: I have no amendments. Anyone else? Amendments? No. No. Comments from the chair? I have no comments today. today. We'll go to the consent agenda. Do I have a motion to accept the consent agenda? [1:10] Commissioner: Motion to accept the consent agenda. Second. [1:12] Chair: Second. All in favor? Department of Reports. Sheriff Mary. Moving right along. [1:25] Staff/Manager: Moving right along. [1:28] Commissioner: I'm going to just provide you a [1:36] Staff/Manager: document on, you know, community corrections and what we're doing and what we report to the state. Because every month we have to report our financials to the state. And this is all part of getting money from the state for diversionary programs and whatnot. So the first part of this first document you see is just a report that kind of crushes what we get for state funding. And then the other documents that you see are basically just a summary of the work that our programs deputy, Quinn, has done in the month of October. You see 19 different individuals. I apologize for the small print. I think [3:05] Commissioner: what's important to see is when you see [3:09] Staff/Manager: the first column there on the left you see what town, you see their age you see the type of call diagnosed, substance abuse the last page is just a weekly main free trial we have an interest in getting back looking at something so [5:16] Chair: these are all calls that came to the mental health [5:18] Staff/Manager: the ones on that spreadsheet [Chair: the back sheet] no, on the back sheet this one? What's not on there is how many hours on each case that she's actually put in and I can just tell you that she [6:03] Chair: does do some correspondence. This is a position we used to share with Brunswick but now we have our [6:23] Staff/Manager: own. Yeah because the numbers were [6:25] Chair: just too great. Yeah. [6:29] Staff/Manager: Okay. Thank you. In addition to that, you have a monthly activity report. I think that's pretty self-explanatory, pretty consistent for a month of where we were in terms of calls. Traffic stops, 172 for the month. That's pretty normal. We didn't have a lot of, because it was in October, and October is not kind of outside the Bureau of Highway Safety details. scales, so that's why that number is a little low right now. In terms of staffing, what I would tell you is that we have one candidate in the process for our open position. We just received the background investigation report and the individual will be moving on to polygraph and psychological exams. [7:35] Commissioner: And we have two in the academy? We don't have any in the academy right now. [7:39] Staff/Manager: We have two that this summer did complete their FTO program, so they're on the road now. However, we're still entered by workers' comp two months, and we're probably going to have another two months. And [8:08] Commissioner: two down. Still tight. [8:14] Staff/Manager: We're still, yeah, we're still a little bit behind where we'd like to be, but we're making progress. Do you recall [9:39] Chair: the number we have now from the second half is up a little bit? [9:43] Staff/Manager: It's 15. It's still low. It's still low in the day-to-day. [9:55] Commissioner: How many from Penobscot this week? Today? [Staff/Manager: Today, 48.] In the zone. What they're being charged for. [10:31] Chair: Some of these, I mean just looking at the Penobscot numbers, some of the folks have been, some of the inmates have been in custody for quite a long time. There's one here that's been in custody for over a year. [10:47] Staff/Manager: Yeah, I mean even if you look at ours, you see that we've got one individual there, at 841 days, although some of that time has been split between the jail and Riverview. As a matter of fact, I believe right now he's currently at Riverview. [11:16] Chair: Sure. I think it would be good to get the mental health liaison in for a presentation to us. That would be a good idea. Because, I mean, you use the phrase community corrections, but it might not be a term that's broadly understood or known, so if she were able to come in and talk about the programming and how it fits within statute. [11:46] Staff/Manager: Yeah, and give you a sense of how she tries to steer people to services and those kinds of things. Yeah. That would be November 10th, yes. [11:58] Chair: I'll make that happen. Great,. and no questions from you. Okay, Jill. [12:05] Commissioner: Good afternoon. For the current art piece that we have open, it's currently only the forecast generator, which is going to be wrapping up in October. We've received one bid so far and a couple others have been fired, so we're hoping we will get more than one bid. We will open the bids at the November commissioner's meeting and then we'll have to formally evaluate them since they're with grant funds before we can make a decision. We're finalizing the details for the carpet RFP that was much more technical than I could have imagined it would be, and we'll publish that in the plowing RFP by the end of this week. Our communications towers are effectively online. The only item left is power to the Pittsburgh site, which should be completed within the next week. RCM would like us to just wait a week or two before we do anything official, just to iron out anything since they come up but we don't foresee any issues and then we can have some sort of go-live ceremony which we can discuss the plans in today's meeting and we are working with RCM on the final accounting for the project there were a few costs that were outside of RCM such as the storage when we had to purchase the new equipment before we were ready so we'll need to reallocate a few funds that way. We can do a couple of budgetary transfers. Research for the IT director is going surprisingly well. We've had many qualified applicants and we have a second round of interviews tomorrow with four of them. Our new staff accountant, Olivia, is doing amazingly. She's cross-training on AP, AR payroll. She's working on schedules to share financials monthly with the department heads to keep them abreast of their finances. and she is training clear that as well she'll be great for that we're starting to close out FY 26 and we aim to have all that documentation complete by budget season just a quick update on health insurance Malcolm is in the process of evaluating other options and trying to find some degree of savings we were able to change our life insurance through the health insurance that was a savings of $0.10 per $1,000 of coverage. That's fairly significant for us. I've also requested information on the health plans offered by neighboring counties to see if there's something that they're doing that might be more cost-effective than what we're doing. The Board of Assessment Review has one active appeal. They received it last week, and it is from Georgetown. They have not set a hearing yet. I will keep you guys posted on that. The Board of Health is here today to discuss the status of the opioid settlement funds and make recommendations for the next cycle. The Midcoast Jail Authority is from Farrell Dana now, so we will begin moving forward with them. We anticipate beginning work during the month of October and concluding in the spring. For staffing, we have openings for two transport deputies, one patrol deputy, and the IT director. One question. Where do we stand with the audit? Same, but we're working on it. Are we supposed to have an answer soon? I hope so, before next year's budget starts. Absolutely, I was talking to Todd about that the other day, and it's my goal to have this completely racked up, because it's ridiculous, and I'm not bringing it into another budget season. [15:51] Chair: Obviously, I don't know your conversation with Todd. [15:56] Commissioner: I've had no conversation. [15:57] Chair: No, I mean, I'm trying to, and just building on Charlie's comment, I mean, I think it's almost imperative that we have at least one current audit going into the budget. Absolutely. I mean, the Budget Advisory Committee is, it's almost always their first question. Definitely. And somehow you've got to get through this audit. [16:21] Commissioner: Yeah, I will say, in fairness, I did not push very hard over the summer when we didn't have that additional position, but now that Olivia is here and we've been buttoning stuff up, has he requested [16:34] Staff/Manager: I mean, this is like what, the 23 or the 24 are, which one? 24 would be the latest request. Okay, and we're ready to submit the 25, right? Yep, that's all wrapped up. Hasn't requested that yet, and we're [16:50] Commissioner: We're about to start closing 26th. [16:53] Chair: We're closing 26th. Yeah, it's almost to the point. I mean, I just know, I mean, Lincoln County is the only county I'm aware of. I mean, it seems like they have a current audit. I mean, you know, I hate to think that we're kind of hanging out there as one of the only counties in the state without, you know, without an audit to post. [17:20] Commissioner: And definitely not one of the only, but I couldn't agree more, and I'm going to be pushing hard before budget season. Okay. Did you get any information back from the state auditor as to why they're reporting that we're so far out of whack? It turns out the former administrators were sending them, which I didn't know, so... Okay. And what's the kilowatts now for the new generator? Did that change from where we started, or where are we now on that? What is the, how much does it be going up for the Hub is a generator for the bit, so we do have a plan for that. Those engineering thought was that we could keep the elevator on the old generator. That's a little less important than communications, for example, so we don't have to redo a grant. Okay, and the other question is the isolation valves. Did we ever have a map made of where they are? Okay, we also want to have him check to see, make sure that our fuse boxes are not. Correctly, I. [18:50] Chair: Just found the IT director. You said you had many, quite a few, well, more inquiries than previous. It's just, do you think that's because the market. [19:04] Staff/Manager: Changed, or I know you've brought in the search. We have many candidates, actually. [19:10] Commissioner: From out of state, several who were actually in the process of moving here. [19:13] Staff/Manager: As a matter of fact, and who's sitting. [19:18] Chair: Who's working with you on the screening? [19:20] Commissioner: It is me, Phil, Mike Carter, Jess, John Bukoff, Rue Dunn, and Jason's going to be joining us for interviews tomorrow. Lucky. Okay. [19:35] Chair: Okay, any other questions? No? Great, thank you, Jill. So action items, we have a bid for facilities condition assessment, and that is? [19:53] Commissioner: Yes, we received two bids here, one from the Bureau Veritas and one from Harriman. They are for identical scope of work, so that shouldn't be an issue. The Bureau Veritas came back at $12,000, and Harriman was $17,000. One difference that you'll see in the Harriman proposal is they did ask if we were interested in a larger analysis, such as our space needs and what we might need to more look to the future, which I told them I'd be interested in seeing the price, but please break it out so we're comparing apples to apples. And that's how we get to the horrifying number at the bottom for the actual facilities condition. [20:39] Staff/Manager: Assessment that would be 17,000, and the other number is 12,000. [Chair: No, including the.] Space needs assessment, including the space needs, that was 59.9, 59, that was the other number. Yeah, big difference. Yeah, do you have a recommendation? I would say go with the. [21:06] Commissioner: The Bureau Veritas, just based on cost alone. [21:10] Chair: Does Harriman have any, I mean, Harriman's local budget, Bureau Veritas is? [21:18] Commissioner: I don't know exactly where they're located. Maryland. Maryland. But we've done other things with them in the past as well, smaller projects. [21:27] Chair: Did you check any of their? [21:30] Commissioner: We've done other projects with them. You know, Saginaw. Yeah. [Chair: We've done projects.] It's Sagamore County, this is the name of the entity, Sagamore County. Veritas. Veritas. And we've done business with Veritas as well. And so what is the ultimate goal? The ultimate goal is to look at the entire county facility between the courthouse and the admin building and all of the components of it, from the electrical to the roof, floors to the furnace, us everything to determine what might need to be replaced and when we can come up with a funded schedule for the project. But this is not designed to see if we need to have a public safety building someplace? No, that was the $59,000 with them evaluating space. I'm in favor of this, but not the other. Sure. And Bill has a grant in the works for that anyway. Well, if we get, you know, a $10 million grant and we build a building, I'll take it. [22:33] Chair: I think the intent here was just to help us prioritize projects, capital projects. [22:41] Commissioner: Where would we get the money for this? We did raise it in the budget this year, except we put in $11,000. That was based on what we've gotten during budget season. So this would be slightly over a year. Can we go back to the, say, we have $11,000 budget? We could try. Why don't you do that? [23:02] Chair: Well, 12 is pretty close to 11. [23:05] Commissioner: Wait,. Hey, listen, this is taxpayer money. No, it's true. We raised $11,000. It's true. We can always show it to somebody else. [23:16] Staff/Manager: So does this mean you have to wait another month before you make a decision on this? [23:19] Chair: I'm going to ask if comments from the floor to make them through the chair be recognized. because I think for purposes of keeping the meeting orderly and also getting people identified when they speak, that would be best. So do you have something you want to add? Yes, Steve. [23:39] Commissioner: Does this mean that we now have to wait another month before we make a decision on this? [23:44] Staff/Manager: And what impact does that have on the whole budget process going forward? Well, [23:53] Chair: I don't think this is a time-sensitive project at this point. I mean, I didn't have an opportunity to look at the schedule for any of this. How long were these guys required to do these studies once identified and approved? I think it would be good to have the results for input into the budget process. So we're talking, you know, when are we talking? March? April? when [24:28] Commissioner: we get it right. They say they can do it within 30 days of us authorizing it. So I would say that my thought, I could go on the rules by this if you want to spend the next $1,000, but I would go back and say, appreciate the quote, we have $11,000 raised in our budget, and you do it for that. And if not, at the next meeting we'll figure out authorizing it on November 9th. Yeah, we can. Or if we have to hold a separate meeting, we can hold a separate meeting. It might just be a quick phone call, and we'll be able to do this. I'd rather not have to keep raising money or pulling money from places if we don't have to. Certainly. [25:13] Chair: And if we approve, and let's say we get a response, we approve this in November, we're still looking, again, in the context of the budget process and input that this would provide. We still have time. [25:27] Commissioner: I will note that during the budget process when we were talking about all of this, we had gotten two quotes from different vendors who turned out not to submit. The first one was for $9,000 and the second was $11,000. And when Aaron spoke with them about the RFP and asked them to participate, they said they wouldn't do it for an RFP, but they would just do it, but not go through the whole all of this. Alright, well, it's worth a shot at this point, because that's what we have to do before we have to go raise other money. How long is this pitch good for? [26:02] Staff/Manager: That's a good question. [26:03] Commissioner: I don't want to miss a time limit then have to pay $14,000. Oh, come on. Charlie's willing to donate it, so that's okay with me too. We'll sell a little table, we'll sell some more trees. [26:26] Chair: I don't see it. [26:29] Commissioner: I can't imagine it's going to be that short a window though. It's probably like a 30-day acceptance. I can't imagine that. And if we have to meet next week, we'll meet next week. [26:44] Chair: I don't see any other cover letter. [26:48] Commissioner: Report delivery date 30 days before from the receipt of the project authorization. So they're going to give us a report 30 days after we've given this. So they're telling us that if we give it to them, say, on the 15th of November and December 15th, we're going to have a report. It's not going to go in the next year. I don't see a So, this is lickety-split, 30 days. [27:16] Chair: Do you have any? Are you all right? Mm-hmm. [27:18] Commissioner: Okay. Unless you see something. I haven't seen anything in there that says a date. I'm surprised you wouldn't put something in there because you don't want the quote to be available for two years from now. Very true. [27:32] Chair: Well, there's also no material here. You know, it's not like they're dealing with inflation or other factors that might raise the cost. [27:40] Commissioner: Well, I think the payroll gets raised every year. [27:54] Chair: I'm okay holding off until November. Okay. If you want to pursue that question later, Tom. Sure. We'll take it as an action item in November. Sounds good. Okay, next action item. Select county representative to serve on the MCOG Board of Directors. [28:24] Commissioner: Yes, they currently have a vacancy since Amber has departed, and they are looking for a nominee from the county to serve on the board of directors. Nominee, not commissioner. Doesn't have to be. It could be a commissioner. Any commissioners want to join me? You're on. I'm on. [28:45] Chair: I'll join Charlie. With whatever risk that entails. It's very risky. [28:52] Commissioner: You'll be meeting a lot with the,, what would we, our chief is Mark from the city of Bath. Sure. Do you know Mark? I do. Okay. I mean, he's the president of our board. Okay. And do you want to, so let me ask you this question. Do we currently have an alternate? We don't currently, but I'm aware of. So I think we should consider having you be our alternate for either. Steve or I, we can't be there, so we always have at least two members there. Okay. [29:27] Chair: All right, let's go. Do we have to take a vote on that? [29:33] Commissioner: We do, I think, yes. [29:34] Chair: So do I have a motion to... [29:38] Commissioner: Todd, you should probably make a motion. Which one of you guys is going to do this? I'm going to do... I'm already on it. [29:44] Chair: So we're nominating Steve and Jill as the alternate. [29:48] Commissioner: Okay, I'll make a motion that Steve be assigned the Council of Governance and Jill be the alternate. I'll second that. I want to see the resume first, though. You got it. [30:06] Staff/Manager: Read it fast. [30:08] Chair: All right, we had a guest. [30:10] Commissioner: He said he'd make it by 3.30. Well, there you go. [30:14] Chair: We're going to move beyond that one. [Commissioner: Back another day.] Okay, discussion item. Discuss the opioid settlement funds and with Board of Health Chair, Melissa Cocasado. [30:29] Staff/Manager: Thank you, Melissa. [30:32] Melissa Cocasado: Hello, I'm Melissa Cocasado. I am the current chair of the Sebekaw County Board of Health and I'm the community health director also from Inquist Hospital, so I have a background in public health. The last time I was here, we had talked about the opioid settlement grant process and we've been working on that and we have an online grant application ready to go with working with a group that is funded by the AG's office and then we decided before we granted that we wanted to make sure we knew how much funding we had and that's when I met with Phil and Jill thank you and Dorian and I met to align everything to make sure that we were on the same page and we discovered that we weren't so that was a good meeting to figure out so I wanted to which is good that we have not given any money up because we wanted to come to you to see how much you wanted to us to grant if any so walk you through this I know it probably doesn't look like a typical account report you see because I'm not an accountant, I'm a public health person, [31:50] Commissioner: so I like colors and tables. [31:52] Melissa Cocasado: So what you see in front of you, just to orient you, is in the green is the actual revenue that the AG has said has been received by San Juan County. So that's the 2022 to 2025 settlement funds that have come in. From 26 to 30 and then below is the amount that is expected to come in annually. When I checked yesterday, we had not received the 2026 funds yet. It had only gone up to 2025. When we made our first grant, we had the first year for granting, we had the projects on the bottom there underneath, were the ones that we had recommended and were approved. When we did that, we had decided with you that if we were going to do a community navigator, that we really wanted to make sure we had the funding for that community navigator to go up to five years. We really wanted to give it a chance. It was a new position. So the scenario on the left is how much that would cost and how much we would have left by year five, which would be county fiscal year 30. So if we included the balance minus what we're estimated for revenue minus the projected community cost that's what that number would be. So that goes down to the county fiscal year 30. What we also found out was that in addition to the projected community navigator cost and the navigator cost obligated for last year and this year, that in addition that the crisis canine annual cost was included. So that was, I have not budgeted for that. So I included that in the current obligated project cost because it's obligated for the current fiscal year. So that's where that $136,001 comes from. So that's already obligated from the settlement funds. And that, to me, makes sense. Those are the projects that came out of the Board of Health as the number one projects they really wanted to see, connecting people with resources and preventing secondary trauma among staff and among community. So we have two scenarios that I wanted to present. So I did a summary on the back, so I could walk through this, because I'm not a numbers person, but I've got to write it down too. So the Board of Health has budgeted in our planning for a community navigator to be assessed and released annually. I think that was very clear from the Board of Commissioners, and we agreed that even though we're saving the money, of course we're going to review it annually to make sure we feel that it's still is impactful and it's still funding that we want to that project that we want to fund, but that we would still keep it, you know, obligate it so that we have available if we decided to do that annually, and that was based on stakeholder input on community need, that was by far the number one community need that we heard, the crisis canine stipend was obligated from this year, and I did a scenario with annual cost included, so you can see that. So if funds for the Navigator are AMR through 2030, as requested from the Board of Punishers when we initially funded it, that leaves $9,800 on June 30th of 2030. And that's assuming all the expected funds are received from the AGs, which has been so far exactly what they predicted, and that there's no unbudgeted expense that we don't that we haven't, we have investigated if both accounting projects are funded then those funds are used earlier, so that covers both of them until June 30th 2029 with 11,000 remaining, so those are the two scenarios we're talking about. I also wanted just to note that the 2026 is anticipated funds have not been received yet by the county. So according to the AG's office, and so the actual balance after the obligated is, oh, it's projected to be, and I cut it off. That does not help. Maybe if we scroll down, Jill, we can see. I did the math and everything and then cut it off. It's estimated to be, next one, right there, $68,204. So we would have funding left. So the question for, that we wanted to pose to you today was, how much the Board of Commissioners would like to award any breather additional fiscal year projects this year, or you know we could wait and do it for next fiscal year starting July 1st and [36:28] Commissioner: open to questions, happy questions to call their one system with community navigator, yeah 25,000 pretty here, that's the first column, the other one was with Navigator plus Crisis K-9, $18,175 per year. So why is that number lower? [36:48] Melissa Cocasado: That's what's left after. So that's the balance. The rejected fund balance after those numbers are taken together. [36:57] Commissioner: So what's it costing per year for, so this is not actually showing what we're actually paying per year for the Crisis K-9. [37:05] Melissa Cocasado: That's based on $125 a year for Navigator and $18,135 a year for the crisis canine. [37:12] Commissioner: So it's $18,135 a year for the, that's the stipend? Yes, exactly. That's what it was. Because the pay for the dog is paid for someone taking care of the dog. Exactly. And all the dog's expenses. [37:23] Melissa Cocasado: The expenses of the... [37:25] Commissioner: There's nothing outside of that. Food, veterinary care, training. [37:29] Staff/Manager: That's all covered. Yeah, by that amount. [37:32] Commissioner: And then the navigator is looking at around... [Melissa Cocasado: $125 a year.] Oh, it's $125 a year for the navigator. Yes, exactly. But that's the benefits. [37:41] Melissa Cocasado: It's a benefit. So this year it's $117, so that's giving us a little cushion to do COLAs. [37:47] Commissioner: So if we don't get money from the AG, the AG money is not the money we're getting. Is that the money they're kicking in besides just the money that we're getting from new opioid settlements? [37:57] Melissa Cocasado: This is everything that we're getting. [38:00] Commissioner: I will add that there are a few opioid settlements that are still pending, so there will be additional funds coming in. We just have absolutely no idea how much. This is the minimal that we are expected to get every year. So my concern is that it looks like by 2030, we're out of money, right? [38:17] Melissa Cocasado: Well, except for we projected to 2030, five years based on that. If you look on the left, 2031 to 2038, you're still getting funding until 2038. But when we... It comes down significantly. Yes. Yes. I think a lot of the companies settled right up front or a five-year plan because they could afford to do that. [38:39] Chair: And this assumes no other awards. [38:44] Melissa Cocasado: Exactly. So the question is, if we wanted to include both county funding, that it really, it goes, it would keep both of those funded until June 2029, K9, which means $11,000 that we could technically award at some point during the next, what is that, three years, but I don't think that's on enough that we might want to keep that as a buffer in case something else comes up. [39:14] Commissioner: So I'm worried about looking at these numbers, is that we'll be lucky to keep the navigator and the crisis K9 stipend with the existing funds that we have here, our projected funds, let alone give away anything else, and that we're looking at something very similar to when we hired the domestic violence investigator back 20 years ago. And it was a grant initially, and then after the grant went away, and that's my question, at the time, I mean, it's a good thing we did this, but it was, okay, when it's over, we're funding it. So I just want to make sure that the Budget Committee is also aware and is a partner on this as we go through this, because at some point we may be funding this 100% if we want a community navigator in Saginaw County. If it's a successful program that's helping our sheriff's department with the recidivism rate and all the different issues we have with people that are in recovery or doing drugs or stealing or whatever, we may need to fund this position going forward at some point when these monies go away. So I just don't want us to get to a point where you say, okay, we've got $10,000 left, and it's only $125,000, and we can keep all this going. Right now we're fine for a few years, but I would want to be very conservative with what we have left. So at least we can keep those two together. Agreed. I know we have people coming to us asking us for extra money, but we don't have any extra money right now. Agreed. [40:52] Melissa Cocasado: And that's why I wanted to make sure that I project it out for you again, because I wanted to be really clear and get your input. Put. I agree, Charlie. I feel like this is not enough of a buffer for me from the Board of Health to say that there is something that $5,000 that we could change the world with opioid. I would much rather leave it in here which leaves it as a buffer plus the minimal. Hopefully that'll go up and it'll cover us for a few more years or at least give the county, if not 100%, maybe 75% of the cost for a few years. Absolutely. I [41:24] Chair: agree with that. But I think what your analysis shows, though, is that even for this current, you know, the upcoming year, what would be the current year, I guess, you're really only committed to the navigator and the crisis came up. I mean, all these other projects. So for you to end up at 2030 with that very small buffer, you really need to tease out the warming the Warming Center well these are all [42:00] Melissa Cocasado: Those are all completed that was to just give you an idea no I know yeah you're [42:05] Commissioner: You're not going to be able to entertain requests oh yeah and I think you can [42:10] Melissa Cocasado: Share that we have the Board of Health that's overseeing this and has projected out for five years, and at this point there is no funding. I think we did a great job together. The navigators are going for ongoing support. Naloxone distribution, I can get you a number, but we have some permanent locations where once they're there, we have staff and free naloxone. So that's a permanent project. Curriculum materials, the police departments, the sheriff's departments have trained people. We gave them curriculum and support to get this going. And then we can look for other, I think, we also have other partners that can cover that. The two comfort canines were, again, an investment that are going to be, you know, I wish, like, 120 years. But, you know, for more than one year. And then the warming center is still going. I'm very active on that group. There's never enough money. But we did give them quite a bit that year. [43:04] Commissioner: So we have two crisis canines. Is one being taken care of by Topsom? [43:09] Melissa Cocasado: Yeah, so Topsom's isn't a crisis canine. Theirs was the American Lesion. It's a comfort one. Yeah, it's a warm comfort. It was specifically designed when we talked to them to be with their student resource officer to make them more approachable to kids and community to increase communication. [43:25] Commissioner: Is that a budget for the second? [43:27] Melissa Cocasado: Yeah, and that's right at top. [43:28] Commissioner: So that's going to be five schools in the case for that? [43:30] Melissa Cocasado: Yeah, they just wanted a little bit towards taking them over the edge for fundraising, and then they came on the annual cost. [43:36] Commissioner: So what's in here now is for our dog, for the EMA. [43:39] Melissa Cocasado: Yeah, for the whole county and to be a crisis. That's a statement. [43:44] Chair: Much I guess I would I would like to see the process driven in part for sure based on outcomes, yeah, not budget, not budgetary needs, yeah, so if we get a proposal from Ted food for the warming center that it be that it be evaluated and we make a determination at some point whether we get more out of the warming shelter or do we get more out of a navigator. We still need that comparison, I think, to drive this. Not so much, well, not so much is not the right way to put it, But I really don't want this, for me, driven only by columns and numbers and how we get to a balance at the end of 2030. It's also a question of what's best for the county. How do we best utilize these funds over the next four or five years and stay within budget, obviously. [45:01] Melissa Cocasado: And I guess I would suggest that has been done. These were choices made on a stakeholder assessment. And the number one, by far, the number one request of the community was we have resources, but people don't know about them, especially when they're in crisis. You can certainly, every year, and I think we did look at that at the last meeting, the results and how many numbers. I also think it's not fair when you're starting something. I put that at year four or five, that at that point we say, okay, we've invested, we've given this position time four or five years, then we see is it still serving, and we get stakeholder input. I really don't think it's fair after one year in our, you know, it's not really enough time for someone to gain trust and know the resources. So I agree with you. I just think it should be a little bit more of a longer time to assess and to do it annually with you. Yeah, but the environment changes as well. Yes. I would love to be a navigator or a warming. I don't think that's going to happen in the next five years. [46:01] Commissioner: So I did say that was it, but I do have a question. Now that you've brought this up, so the community navigators was identified as one of the referrals to the Sheriff's Department. So on that list that you gave us, I saw community navigator down there. [46:20] Chair: I think it appeared on the list three times. [46:21] Commissioner: It appeared on the list that you gave us. Yeah. Okay, so my question is, how does the community navigator, I mean, I know the community navigator is not necessarily law enforcement. It's more of looking at anybody in a health crisis as well and whatever, not even the criminal necessarily. [46:37] Staff/Manager: So where do they intersect? That's your question. [46:40] Commissioner: Well, yeah, because I see that on your report, where community navigator is listed as at least one of the referrals of somebody who maybe had psychiatric issues. [46:48] Staff/Manager: Yeah, that, homelessness, those kinds of things. Actually, when their offices were right side by side, They don't have regular communication. So they kind of lean on each other. [47:02] Commissioner: So this is very helpful for the sheriff's department? [Staff/Manager: At times, yes.] But they're not law enforcement. They're really kind of the eyes and ears on the ground. Oh, yeah. [47:11] Staff/Manager: This is, you know, we get called to a lot of different scenarios. And then after, we can step back and then let these resources do their thing. That's ideally how it's done. [47:25] Commissioner: So it is a good position. Is a good position to have a fatal side-off so you don't have to really look at arresting anybody or whatever. You can actually work out the problems with this training. This person can work out problems before it becomes an arrest [47:36] Staff/Manager: situation. Yeah, I kind of like to look at it through the lens of Maslow's theory. So if we take care of the very basic needs, which the Navigant does, which the Mental Health Liaison does, then we would have less interaction. We also have [47:54] Melissa Cocasado: the navigators information at the food pantries as well often they'll be the first place we see people and especially right now people really worrying about heat and living in their cars living in their cars and so helping people fill out snap applications helping people know where they can get fuel fill out the paperwork so often we'll send them to mark so we have I've introduced Mark to all of the points of access, basically, which is often food pantries, our access to care, a person who helps with medical bills knows who he is, I know who he is, United Way. So really working with the community to connect them with Mark. [48:36] Commissioner: Does he work with a Cumberland County person? Is there somebody in Cumberland County? There was one. [48:44] Melissa Cocasado: There's a behavioral health person that I'm sure knows who he is, but there's no community. There's one in Booth Bay. [48:51] Commissioner: Cumberland has to put any money up in this area. No,, no. [48:55] Melissa Cocasado: Exactly. Brunswick has some funding and Portland has funding and I don't know. I haven't seen what the Cumberland County funding is. [49:01] Commissioner: But we're just dealing with mostly Sagat Hock. [49:03] Melissa Cocasado: Completely, yeah,, yeah. His office is here. He's often out and about here. But food pantries, we often get people from everywhere. But if they're from Sagat Hock, we'll say Mark is [49:13] Commissioner: available. And I have not seen this, but do we have this on our website? Is it on the SAGADOC website? It's a very clearly, you know, like front page, you know, when you're in crisis, contact, whatever. I think it's under the health page. Well, so my suggestion would be we put something on the SAGADOC page because, you know, it doesn't have to be the whole front page, but, I mean, there's something on there where someone could literally, in crisis, contact us, you know, and it also helps the EMA as well, but that would be better because people just aren't necessarily going to navigate more to health. Yeah. Yeah,. Most counties don't have a Board of Health. Right. [49:49] Melissa Cocasado: No counties have a Board of Health review. [49:51] Commissioner: Probably the only Board of Health in Maine. [49:53] Melissa Cocasado: County Board of Health. [49:54] Commissioner: Okay, so maybe we don't have to be following, so. There we go. [49:58] Melissa Cocasado: Also, like, he's going to the United Way. He's probably going to go with me. They're going together, a meeting, what's it called, the meeting? [50:05] Commissioner: A community assistance meeting. Yeah. Talk about other options. [50:08] Melissa Cocasado: So Mark will be there, so all of the resources will know who he is, and he knows who all the resources are. So what's going on right now to help people connect resources? So how are you [50:17] Chair: going to, how are you going to proceed? So if you want to go through the cycle, yeah. [50:25] Melissa Cocasado: I suggest that we, that we decide not to fund any more projects at this time, and then I come back to you annually to let you know how the navigator, how many numbers, what that work is looking at, and we say do we want to fund them another year, and if so, we should give them a chance to make it. So I think it should be an annual to annual, and I think at this point, looking at these numbers, I would like to see a buffer to keep this person going for four or years to five years. Maybe we can make up the difference, but yes, I say we are using our opioid settlement money as the community intended to fund a community navigator and support the crisis canine at this point [51:10] Chair: for the next five years. And when would we see that evaluation? [51:14] Melissa Cocasado: We just did the evaluation in the last meeting, so I would give it another year, but certainly you tell me and we can run the numbers, because we're working with Moss, and so they have monthly evaluation numbers [51:26] Commissioner: that we can pull. Well, I think it would be good if we saw something, even if it's not the final annual report, but if we could see something in like maybe March or April, while we're doing the budget side, even though this is not part of our budget, but with the budget advisory committee involved with us, if we could do some sort of a half-year report on where we stand and how the navigator is interfacing with our sheriff's department and other community services and some of the success stories you have, that would be a really good thing. [51:57] Melissa Cocasado: March would be good because it would be through the winter. I think a lot of the calls are really during this winter when you're going to have power outages and heat. So March, I think, would be good. So I can come back in March or earlier whenever you want that and run the numbers. [52:14] Chair: Do you think in the committee that you've talked this over with the board at home? [52:19] Melissa Cocasado: We said that we were going to look at the numbers and come back to them after we talk to you. So the next step would be bring it to the board and say... Definitely bring it to the board. We're pretty certain 100... well, I'm very certain that the board will agree with this. I think we've talked about it in theory that this is our number one. This is why we put it there. It was agreement when we did it. This is our number one priority is to fund this position. Everything else is helpful, but this is really by far the number one. But I can certainly get a formal vote on that. [52:51] Chair: Well, I personally think that stakeholder input is important. Absolutely. Because like I said a while ago, I mean, the environment does change. I mean what might have made you know the obvious choice a year ago might not be [53:07] Staff/Manager: the other's choice to certain members of the board sure so evaluation and I'm [53:18] Commissioner: okay with making a motion to have us continue for the next year with this which Michelle has, Melissa has, Melissa has, Melissa has, I like to call you Michelle. [53:29] Melissa Cocasado: Everyone does, I don't know why. MF. [53:33] Commissioner: Yeah. Right, so I think we're okay going ahead this year. And if you still want to entertain proposals, you certainly can entertain proposals, but letting them know that really we're trying to protect this position that the commissioners really feel is important. important. But they could continue to every year ask for money. Absolutely. I think that's [53:56] Melissa Cocasado: a good point, that we're not going to seek value. We have an application. We could certainly put that out. But if we don't have money, I think we could certainly entertain but not seek out applications. [54:08] Commissioner: And who knows, there could be another grant that comes through or it could be other private money or whatever. So we don't want to ever shut the door [54:14] Staff/Manager: on Ted for anything. Yeah, absolutely. [54:16] Commissioner: But this is something I think is important to see where we go in the next three or five years I'm not quite as [54:26] Chair: enthusiastic about it I guess without seeing what the sense of the board is you know because they're the ones who made the initial recommendation you're pretty confident they're going to agree with you so this [54:43] Commissioner: This is not, the board hasn't re-recommended this? [54:45] Melissa Cocasado: They have, we haven't gone to them last month, we have talked about it when we started talking about applications and the plan was, always has been, to have the community navigator funded first and then see what happens, but I don't know if it's in the minutes either. I think it's an official notice. [55:03] Commissioner: Why don't we do this, so today I will make a motion, we will table this for the next meeting if you want until you come back and say this is what the Board of Health has voted on and then we can make a motion to what do you think, Todd? I've got a question for you. I thought you were all wound up. I'm not wound up at all. I'm pretty chill right now. On the sequence of events say what the town does and what the navigator does, where does that cross over? Someone applies for general assistance. Oh, yeah,, they received funding for fuel. Yeah. But she just helped them up with the proper paperwork to get a different funding other than the town. [55:47] Melissa Cocasado: Yes, all of the above so I've seen it work both way. He someone would go to general assistance and say they know what they needed and they might say find out anyone might find out you probably qualify for other things or the person that isn't quite understanding what's needed that they could pull Mark in, and he does an assessment and goes through and thinks about all the things they might qualify for. Did you know that you could get food delivered if you don't have transportation? [56:17] Commissioner: So do the towns know that this person is even there? [56:21] Melissa Cocasado: Yes, they should. I mean, that's what he's been working on. And so we can certainly do, we can certainly ask that. I'm trying to think if that's part of the valuation. If not, we could, how many contacts have they made? but we could ask him how many contacts with providers have you made versus... [56:34] Commissioner: Did it come from the town to say, go to this guy and he can help you out? Exactly. So you maxed out on your general assistance. Now you can sign up for this program and you can continue on. That's right. [56:44] Melissa Cocasado: The meetings that he does with the... There's a Brunswick Area Resource Council, and they get how many providers are there. I mean, it's pretty big, but I don't know general assistance. But the CAP agency is there. Mark is there. [56:57] Staff/Manager: United Way is there. This is a dozen-fifty. Yeah. [57:00] Melissa Cocasado: Yeah, so those, there's a lot of folks that know about them. Do I know that he's been to every general assistant? Certainly he could tell me. [57:07] Commissioner: Does not tell him to go to a general assistant first. [57:10] Melissa Cocasado: Both, exactly. That could be both, like have you. That's why I think it's the beauty of it. He can, he doesn't sit it either. He can go both ways. [57:19] Commissioner: So Todd, you were a selectman, right, over there in Willich. So, and I was a selectman in Thompson. I thought that the general assistants is a fairly narrow scope of what they can actually do. I mean, they have a very short leash on what they can provide because it's taxpayer dollars at the local town level. But this guy has access to all the federal funds and all the other federal programs, but if they're an emergency person, we would want to be able to go to this. If they probably give them way more than the towns, we give them a basic amount and doesn't have the resources to go deep so it is imperative that these general assistance people know yeah this is and I hope the people that are doing the general assistance the town city will make sure I'm sure you have you that I will double check whoever the administrator is for general assistance with the town should say okay here's where other things may be there and sometimes it's a person doing it with three other jobs yeah they're not necessarily just doing general assistance. There could be four. The job is really the job you're doing. It's just like two hours on Thursday they're open. Not necessarily seven days a week. [58:31] Melissa Cocasado: And then Mark was doing, I was with him last year. We were out. He had just been hired maybe a month or two, but one of the things we did was we did a food drive and he was there talking about at-shaws. So he was interacting with people grocery shopping. So people would know who he was, how to get in touch with him. So he does a lot of being in the community, introducing confusing himself. So, I mean, his name's come up a few times now. I mean, just, I mean, this is all qualitative, but I'll be in meetings where they're like, oh, he has a navigator, right, Mark? I'm like, absolutely. So, he's definitely getting out there. But I will double check, that's a good one, just to make sure that he has it. [59:05] Chair: do you i don't know if you or phil work with him on a regular basis to set some objectives for example you know for i mean just following up on the conversation [59:19] Commissioner: So in your commissioner's report for this month, you saw that he was one of the goals that we had set for him this year was to create what we're calling satellite office hours. So starting in October, he is working, I think the first one is in Arousik and the second one is in Bath. So he's going to be going to each of the different communities and having what we're calling satellite office hours, and that allows people that don't have transportation to be able to come and meet with him directly. [Staff/Manager: Okay.] I mean, I think [59:59] Staff/Manager: I just had a comment. [1:00:03] Commissioner: So I'm a United Way representative, and I administer the Midwest Coalition that does free taxes, and I invited Mark to come to some of our Saginaw Hawk locations to talk about financial education, asset building, what programs were available, and he would sign people up for community navigation services on the spot. So we found that was another crossover where we were bringing in the public to get their taxes done for free, and he could sit with them, but we just restricted it to Saginaw-Hawk County, which was boneham and bad. [1:00:37] Chair: I mean, I think if you can get back to us with a sense of the board. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, it's been, I won't say convenient, but it's been our representation to the public and to the Budget Advisory Committee and others that we take guidance and give a lot of credibility to the Board of Health on the recommendations. So I think it's important that we have that also going forward. And also if you have, you know, quantitative and qualitative measures that we're doing with the navigator, that's fine. So I mean, I'd like to see them, they're most updated. Yeah, and we can, we can respond to you at that point, I guess. Is there a health meeting [1:01:33] Staff/Manager: Well, you can pull, yeah, I'll do whatever, then it's sort of health and then and then schedule here to go back and see you after that. Anything else you need, anything you need help, well, we're [1:01:42] Commissioner: not going to, we're going to table this for the next, meeting. Yep. Okay, that's good [1:01:49] Staff/Manager: to me. Should we take a vote on that? [1:01:51] Commissioner: We don't need to take a vote on table. No. [1:01:54] Melissa Cocasado: Okay. Thank you very much. So thank you so much. [1:01:57] Chair: Thank you for coming. Thank you for working the numbers. [1:02:02] Melissa Cocasado: Yes. My favorite, second favorite thing to do before talking about it. That's everything. Thank you. Thanks. Thanks. [1:02:16] Chair: All right. We're going to take a step back in our agenda and we have, We have the MCCA president and the commissioner who's down from Bangor to give his annual report. Here's a little reminder. [1:02:36] Commissioner: We're set. With a cigar. [1:02:39] Andre Cushing: You missed it, Mr. Crowder. I appreciate you giving me a commitment to do my annual presidential visit and talk to you about some of the things that have been going on. For the record, I'm Andre Cushing. I serve both as a commissioner of Penobscot County and president for the MCCA. We have had a couple of good years. You hosted a very successful convention in Saginaw Hawk last year. We had good attendance and kind of rebounded post-COVID from sort of a downturn in attendance and activity. This year, we were at Sunday River. It was another successful convention, about 150,000 to 160,000 attendees. We had 30 exhibitors this year and a number of sponsors that got us to similar levels of about 72,000 in revenue from sponsors. We also had a silent auction in the golf tournament that generated a little bit of money. So we should net out after expenses when we get the final bill from Sunday River, the same area that we were last year. So we should hopefully have another $50,000 to put into reserves. So that puts us in a good posture and it shows that we're able to generate support and some good panels. I know Todd has both consistently represented you on the board and has been a faithful attendee and helper, so I appreciate Saginaw Hawk's participation in that. I think that we're, as an organization, in a better position with the legislature. Last year, we were able to secure an additional four million dollars. As you may remember, the state has mandated, a certain amount of money that they would allocate to the jails post-returning them to the counties to operate. That has remained pretty flat since 21. The supplemental monies that historically were coming also flatlined, so it put a lot of jails and counties in a difficult position, especially when there are counties that are in excess of their license and have to board out, which I will note personally for Penobscot County, we're grateful for the work that we've been able to do with two bridges to secure a number of inmates down here. But there are other counties that are also feeling the crunch, and the jail cap is a difficulty that does not always allow those counties to properly generate the revenue they need. Hence, they are eroding their fund balances or their reserve accounts. So this year, we start out at the same level of $20.4 million, and we are going to seek $8 million in the supplemental budget that will come up the first part of session. Following that, we will be seeking approval again of the Bill 2232, 32, which has the language that ups the state share back to around 20%. That would be the $30 million range. It also has key language in there that the sheriff would be able to explain more accurately, but there's a percentage of that money that has to go to community corrections now. The language in the new bill would reduce that. I think it's down, Sheriff. [Commissioner: Is it 15%?] Do you remember? [1:06:17] Staff/Manager: Yeah, I think it is going to go down to 15%. Right now it's, what, at 25%. [1:06:23] Andre Cushing: So that frees up some money that were already promised for other things besides community corrections, which are important, but for some counties that's not as significant a need as operational needs are. The COLA being in there is also important so that the legislature recognizes that if DOC costs go up and other costs go up for the counties we should also be recognized and finally using the past year's number so that you can more accurately judge what your revenue should be rather than waiting to see what your gym troubles are for this year will take some of the drama out of budgeting processes which is a good thing one of the areas that we are looking at and the board will be discussing tomorrow at our in our virtual meeting is the idea of an executive director position for the Association again we used to have that the option was made about four years ago to go to a lobbying firm they've been very helpful in a number of ways in steering us through the process I don't know if any of you have had legislative experience here but occasionally that can be a little difficult to get our message across. So having Vero on board has been tremendously helpful, opening some doors and keeping us apprised. But there's a limit to what they can do as a contract lobbying firm. They only have so much time and capital they can spend on any particular client's issues. Having a voice that's down there, explaining what's going on, building relationships, doing the things that we need. in the State House and with our commissioners to meet with their legislative delegations is going to be crucial for us going into this next session when we're facing unfortunately a billion three projected shortfall in revenues compared to expenses the other thing that person would do is generate the revenue for convention and other activities to make sure that we're We're not putting the full burden on the property tax dues-paying counties. And finally, developing some things that would be helpful in orientation, drafting model policies, bringing in resources that could help counties in areas that they have to operate in, that if we had some outside help at times, it could be beneficial. So those are some of the reasons that we're looking at that position. The board will likely give its intention in November so that the budget committee can craft a budget accordingly and present that in December at our meeting, which will be held in Hancock County. It will be at their new EOC Center, so it will be an opportunity for us to tour another new facility and visit our friends in Hancock County. Other than that, I'm happy to try and answer any questions. I've given you the save the date for next year. We're trying to get back on an annualized schedule so folks can plan for the event and we can promote this and get more support. [1:09:42] Commissioner: I have a question. If we were to go out and hire an executive director, what would be the criteria for what we would want as commissioners? I'm thinking about this in terms of the political field. You and I both, we've both been former legislators, different sides of the aisle. So I did apply for this position once way back and was considering stepping down as a county commissioner and wasn't even given an interview. And probably it was because I was a county commissioner and I'm also a Democrat. So it depends on who you have in there. And I'm just stating something that is my concern now as opposed to it coming out later on. Cut through the BS is that, you know, if Democrats take the governor's seat and they're all in power and we have a Republican leading, for instance, there's a known Republican leading the organization, how does that serve as well as just having somebody with a non-political entity who comes in as a professional? So I want to make sure that if we're going to do this, I would support this, but I want to make sure that we're thinking about the elephant in the room and how sometimes people perceive people before they even meet them. And so I have a political past, you have a political past, we're all politicians, but one of us might end up applying for this job. And when Jim Cohen's representing, he may be a political party, but he 's pretty much a part of a nonpartisan guy up there doing the halls he's not looked upon as somebody who's already served and well that guy's that and that guy's that and having been a commissioner now since 1993 in my 27th year I've seen about everything happened that you can possibly happen politically up there and it's pretty ugly you know and being ahead of this organization is a little bit like herding cats you have some counties that are completely they want nothing to do with the rest of us some counties do want to work with us but we've had counties that you know unless there is cool they come back you have some commissioners who say ah leave me out of it so you it is a very delicate balance that you're that you're doing you know you do it so I just wanted to throw that out there that 's my concern about not making what the great work you've done so far as a volunteer out the window. I'm concerned about us going to this next step and then going backwards because of people thinking it's a politicized thing. So I hope I'm not being a jerk to bring this up, but this is the elephant in the room to me. [1:12:38] Andre Cushing: It's a valid constraint, Charlie, because you've been there enough to know that if you don't build relationships with people, then it does create a kind of, we're going to put people in a box based upon various factors. I first served in the legislature, I was appointed to the labor committee, and as you remember that was a fairly contentious committee. So John Towle and I agreed to have lunch once a week, he was the house chair, and we would talk things over and we came to an understanding that we weren't always going to agree, but that if there were important things that could affect the state in how they were implemented, that we would ask the parties to come back up in the hall and come up with some reasonable solutions. And we ended up with only six divided reports out of 68 bills that came through that year. So I think times are different. I'm not going to, you know, try and cross over. But relationships are the strength on which we as an organization can depend to get access and at least have a fair hearing. We're not always going to get what we need, but I think if we select the right person, he or she that has the commitment to the organization and understands the role that they have to play as an ambassador, regardless of what somebody's position politically is, that it could be helpful. And these are the type of things we need to flesh out. We are set with a draft job description that Kerry Kipfer created for us. We do have some of the previous information, you know, historically that went on. We've had several executive directors as you may remember, but we need to clearly define what we expect from that person if we're going to go forward. We've got the resources potentially in the bank right now to cover us for the first year, so it's not a gamble that puts the counties at risk to cover, not that it's hard to cover, but I think these type of questions are the things that we need to flesh out before we make that decision. I've enjoyed what I've been able to do and the people I've worked with. I think there's tremendous value in this organization. I think there's greater value if we incorporate our county partners, though. I think that there are groups now that do good work for counties, and they do their separate meetings. Nothing wrong with that, but I think if we can find a way to represent all of them under one umbrella as most other states do, there's, there's greater value for the operation of the county government too, and that's why we talk here if you see a kind of template logo there for a main [1:15:39] Staff/Manager: county association or association of counties, whatever, they still would be including deeds [1:15:46] Commissioner: and just all the different parts of all these individual groups would also be part of this possibly? [1:15:54] Andre Cushing: If they wish to be, yes. They can keep their autonomy as a group, but under the umbrella of an association, the things that needed to be filled in and supported, legislative initiatives, organizing of meetings, the 911 folks do a good job. I've been at their conference the last couple of years, and they have to have continuing ed training. The EMA folks have a good organization, but being a small cohort of counties, it's tougher sometimes to do everything that they'd like to. And planning a meeting is not a simple thing. You all who have been involved know there's a lot of moving parts. So if we were able to develop an event schedule that benefited all of them, provided the training they need for their continuing ed, provided the networking opportunities, I think that could be a valuable resource for us. [1:16:51] Chair: You know, I participated in a couple of conversations with the Finance Committee meeting, and you know, there is some concern about it's a big step, it's a it's a lift, and you know, whether you know they're there are two sides of this. Is the organization mature enough to take on an executive director and look at that next step? And then the second part of that, obviously, is the resources that would be necessary to accomplish that, and recurring resources, not depending on ad, you know, money set revenues that might come in based on sponsorships, ads, but, you know, where is the, you know, where is the more dependable stream of funds and funding that would, you know, would support this? I think I, you know, one concern I have, I don't have as much experience as certainly Charlie or Todd might have with Vero, but,, you know, Jim Cohen's done a good job, my understanding is. Certainly he's done a good job for the counties going forward. And the proposals that we've looked at or that I've looked at, you know, essentially would terminate, would largely terminate that relationship, you know, going forward. So that's something. [1:18:31] Andre Cushing: It seems like the board is, particularly the budget committee, struggling because they need guidance from the board as to... The goal here, Steve, is to discuss it tomorrow at this meeting and then take the vote in November so you can craft the final budget for it. [1:18:50] Commissioner: One of the other concerns, I'll just throw out, because you'll be there and I won't, but Doug will be there and Steve will be working on the finance side of it. You know, I mean, we're in better shape now than we were when I first was on MCCA back in 1993. Paul Howe had it, Tassie Crockett, Stone Ages. Anyway, and then we went to Charlie Prey, and it was a different situation under Charlie, and Charlie had his strengths and his weaknesses, and did a good job for a period of time, and then we decided to get Jim involved. And I have been very, I've known Jim a long time, and I knew him when he was up there, and he did too, as a lobbyist. He's a very likable, skilled negotiating guy who knows the ropes, and I think he's done a fantastic job helping us with bills. Not that a new director couldn't necessarily do, but I am concerned about some of the outlier commissioners, and I'm concerned about this organization of 16 counties taking a vote and having nine counties or ten counties say let's go for it and seven say no and what that will do to our organization. So I think that we need to make sure that if we're going to do this, we've got a super critical mass of commissioners, because it only takes a couple of counties to say, you know what, we're out, and now you've destroyed all the great work we've done. I'm not, you personally, I'm saying that all this work is, because when I was first involved back then, there were some counties that didn't even want to even participate at all, you know, and they would just not even show up, and they would complain about their dues, you know, and then they left and they came back. So, you know, if we can get all 16 counties around this, you know, certainly that's the goal that we have to strive for, somehow find a balance that works without having one or two counties say, well, if you do that, I'm out. I know that risks one county messing up the whole thing for us. But, I mean, we're working with a third county now with our jail. Unless you have complicit partners, people that are willing to work with you, 're not going to make it happen. We had hopes of four counties, and now we've got three. Trying to get two counties to work together is hard. Three counties is a miracle. So we're about to be the only three-county jail system north of Virginia, and we've now been the two-county jail system for the past 20, 25 years. Counties don't necessarily always play nice together and work with each other. They sometimes can be, like, a little territorial or, like, you know. And so I see our role as a county commissioners organization as promoting things like when legislation comes up to have something like a budget committee and what their role is, which I hear that there's some work right now that's possibly trying to streamline it so that maybe all counties can be in the same type of budget approval process as opposed to one county has the final, the budget committee has the final say, another county, you know, they have to have a certain kind of a, you know, percentage between the budget committee and the commissioners. And some commissioners have no voice at all. They just get elected and they can't even set the budget. You know, so, and that doesn't work. So, you know, we can be a facilitator of those kinds of things, other regional programs, you know, and I like the idea of education, around this because we need to educate the taxpayers as to what county government does and why we're the best value for their money as opposed to the 500 towns we have, which is great to have towns, but they need our county services for centralized dispatch and for sheriff's department. The rural patrol is critical in some parts of the state. [1:22:36] Andre Cushing: I think today was a good example of where you found partnerships [1:22:40] Commissioner: on the health side. If I [1:22:43] Andre Cushing: understand correctly, you have I have joint relationships with the comfort dogs. You've got the navigator that's working across different parts of your county. I've talked with the folks in Cumberland County. They're doing assessing for those towns that want to contract with them. They've started to pick up general assistance duties. They've done some dispatch beyond just EMS and public safety. Some of the public works have been dispatched through their regional center. There are opportunities that we should be working on, and I've had conversations with MMA about this. I went to their convention last week and met with Tanya Emery, Amanda Kempbell, and Kate Dufour again, and we're going to sit down and have lunch and potentially involve Tim Curtis from administrators association and so on to sit and talk about areas that we could collaborate on and I'm not talking about forcing people to regionalize I'm looking for willing partners who want to do things and they see the county as a better vehicle so assessing code enforcement taking care of cemeteries back office operations where you're seeing more and more people changing out of these jobs. I just, with Upton Knox, they're losing their administrator again. She has some personal issues family-wise and so she's going to need to step away from that role and that's unfortunate. I think she's done a nice job there. It's nothing related to the job other than working 60 hours a week doesn't always give you time for. We need to develop some resources to help those folks who are constantly feeling things. Finance directors are a challenge in many cases. HR, I mean, we could go through the list, but I think you get the concept. We as an organization stand in an important position to start supporting these things. And I think the more we offer, the more people will want to participate and be part of something because there's the value to it. I'll be honest, my first meeting, and I went to when I got appointed, the vice president stood up halfway through the meeting and said, I've had enough. I'm done. I quit. And I'm like, okay, not my circus. I've got other things to do. But when I got the call a couple years ago, I said, you know, there are good people in this group. We just need to bring them together and let them know that there's an opportunity here. And I think we're on the right path. It's just how do we finally we get to the destination. And more importantly, let's start talking about what the goals are that we as an organization could do. Developing a new strategic plan I think will be helpful to us. And the sheriffs are actually pretty good people. [1:25:46] Commissioner: I've found working with them. Really? [1:25:50] Chair: At least y'all. They're trying. [1:25:53] Commissioner: They're a very active sheriff's association. And one that I don't foresee them under our umbrella, but I do think we work well together with the Serious Association, and we try to work together in regards [1:26:18] Andre Cushing: to that there is a group that you may or may not be aware of, three sheriffs, three administrators, three commissioners who are reviewing Title 38 to look at proposed legislation. [1:26:32] Commissioner: Somebody put a sign for a package. Is it for the sheriff's department? Not a sign, just a library. I forgot. [1:26:42] Staff/Manager: There was one missed in the vehicle. All right, thank you. [1:26:45] Andre Cushing: The last ad I've seen with Amazon who were his fights break out. I don't know. [1:26:49] Chair: A plain brown wrapper box. [1:26:55] Commissioner: You're on camera. [1:27:02] Andre Cushing: For coming down, I think it's important that we discuss it at the board meeting, that we understand the nuances of people's interests and concerns. [1:27:15] Chair: We look forward to [1:27:18] Commissioner: as long as Todd remembers what I just said, we're all set, and you already know as well how I feel, and you also can, having lived it like I have, it's real. [1:27:31] Andre Cushing: Just so you're aware, we were really devastated that you weren't able to join us this year. I'd worded in extra [1:27:39] Commissioner: refreshments, maybe next year. [1:27:49] Andre Cushing: The auction probably suffered too. [1:27:51] Chair: I just spent a lot of money at the auction last year, [1:27:55] Commissioner: and he didn't win anything. I didn't win a lot. I spent over a thousand dollars last year. I didn't buy the mega. Okay, that was thank you, baby. That's all. Yeah, thank you. [1:28:19] Chair: Very much okay still under discussion. Items number C, consider the use of grant funds to purchase EMA-directed vehicles, and I guess there's a net spec sheet. [1:28:38] Commissioner: Yeah, and so the only question I have about this, and I'm sorry if I'm ignorant about it, but we still have not done a contract. Have we done a contract yet with? Yes, we have signed on with Enterprise. We have signed on with Enterprise. Yes. So how does this, so does Enterprise provide a card to us, or is this outside of Enterprise's thing? This is outside of Enterprise. The quote from Enterprise was nearly $20,000 more than this vehicle. But my question is not that. My question is, this vehicle is outside of it. Do we have to budget other money for the repairs and all that kind of stuff off-budget? We're trying to save money on the overall program for the replacement of this vehicle. So I don't know how this all works as opposed to... [1:29:24] Chair: Why don't you go through that? [1:29:25] Commissioner: No,, but I wanted to find, first off, this is outside of the Enterprise. Yep. So, and I've got some information for you guys here. So we did contact Anthony and asked him to kind of provide us some information as well. Anthony is who? The Enterprise person. So you saw the one that we believe is going to be the best fit for the EMA office here. We do budget in our budget. We do budget for some repair and maintenance costs and everything like that. In Enterprise, they did quote us to actually take the maintenance costs, so it would cost us roughly $73 a month for the maintenance, on top of that. There's that number. However, we decided to go outside the contract because it was such a significant difference in the price of the vehicle. So they want $90,000 and we're doing it for $47,000? Correct. Well, [1:30:28] Chair: you know, my concern is that are we always going to find exceptions to the contract, to the Enterprise contract? Is that what this process is about? [1:30:37] Commissioner: No, I think when we did the comparison to everything, we can get roughly, you know, five, seven, ten years out of a vehicle for what we drive them compared to what the patrol deputies are driving them. Them. We drive it a little bit differently where these guys are driving all the time constantly, hardcore lights and sirens, where we're coming in at a different pace. So it's not necessarily within the contract, but that stark difference in numbers was kind of eye-opening for us to be able to get what we are needing and to also make it safer for us on the roadway. So this is identical vehicle? Correct. But they've got a capitalized amount. So the capitalized price of the vehicle is $89,000. Yes. The MSRP is $61,800 at Quirk from you guys and they dropped the price down to $47,000. They give you $20,000 off. Off. Why? Why? Because it's a statement in pricing? I mean, you know, honestly, if it doesn't mess up our contract with Enterprise, I mean, I think it would be hard for me to justify spending $90,000 in Enterprise and LUS as long as that's not going to be an issue. How do you feel about this, Jill? That's completely a non-issue. We could only do one part of that if that's what we wanted to do with Enterprise. There's no minimum or maximum Yes, so this does not affect the sheriff's department. And we didn't do them all anyway. We didn't do the whole fleet. We only did a parcel, didn't we? Yes. Yes, we only did a parcel. So we're not doing just a parcel. And you guys are crunching numbers. It's going to be a savings for us overall doing the fleet with how many cars we need to buy and take off the road. Because you're putting 100,000 miles every three years on these cars, right? [1:32:41] Andre Cushing: Just about four years, yes. Yes. [1:32:43] Chair: What does it cost to outfit this is the base price [1:32:48] Commissioner: It would cost us roughly $30,000 to outfit you received information on what we have for grant funding so grant funding minus the vehicle leaves us plenty of money in there that we can outfit the vehicle $15,000 right What's the difference between your vehicles and his I don't know what I don't know how much is your own fitting 27 26 or 27 for a canine yes yeah you said 70 000. [1:33:22] Chair: 30 000. Oh 70 total he has a lot more equipment than he rolls around than we do though too I think [1:33:30] Commissioner: With the EMA stuff with the radios and the drones and you have the drone computer set up and all [1:33:35] Chair: That would that would go included in that yeah oh that's okay is this a drone car sure if you want [1:33:41] Commissioner: to call it that okay so what is this so if we do this and we approve this what 's where is the other is there another vehicle is this vehicle being passed down to the deputy so right Now the way we have it structured within the within the quote is it is a completely brand new vehicle 100 percent nothing is changing so we just want to we want to get that first, because the EMA, the current vehicle, it could replace one of the other ones that we have, the one that's got 114,000 miles on it. [1:34:20] Chair: You have three vehicles, right? We have two. [1:34:23] Commissioner: There'll be three after this, for instance. Yes. And then I'm taking money. [1:34:28] Chair: Well, I thought the Navigator had a car. [1:34:30] Commissioner: Correct. So I have a vehicle, and the Navigator has one. [1:34:34] Chair: Well, it actually has a car. It's just not. [1:34:36] Commissioner: This is not about the deputy's car at this point. Not at all. All this is about, I just want to make sure we get it all straight. This is about, does the Navigator take your car that has a lot less mileage and then we dump the other car? Are these guys willing to take the car with $114 and give us any money for it towards this car? So it was not structured in the pricing like that. We can certainly reach out to them. I just didn't know, because otherwise you might get nothing for it, but they may give you a three. I just straightened a car and got to give a junker to a guy and he gave me $3,000 off the lease of a vehicle. I couldn't give it away. So maybe... Yeah, we can definitely throw that in as an option, but that pricing is 100% no trade-ins whatsoever. It is as it is. I'd like to deal, so I'm in favor of it. No, I want it for my car. [1:35:29] Chair: And your car would go... I wouldn't be getting the administrator. [1:35:33] Commissioner: She can have the community. I know. [1:35:35] Chair: So your car would go to the Navigator. Is that the plan? We would restructure on how that goes. Yeah. [1:35:40] Commissioner: Right now the Navigator has a vehicle that's got 100, I think it's like just over 114,000 miles on it, probably shouldn't even be on the road at this point, and your vehicle is about 30. It's 30. [1:35:54] Chair: Almost 40. I think we need, we need to assess that or evaluate that. Yeah, we weren't going to include [1:36:00] Commissioner: that as part of the conversation. That's a completely different thing. We just have a great deal on this vehicle right now, and we can figure out the other part after. I'll make a motion to do this. [1:36:09] Chair: Well, let me just ask you just a [1:36:11] Commissioner: couple other questions. Just put a motion on the table. That's all. We don't have to approve it. We'll get a motion. Second. Discussion. [1:36:21] Chair: I think just clarify for me going forward. We're still, we have an agreement with Enterprise. Are we setting a pattern where we're going to deal with fleet issues only as they relate to the Sheriff's Department and let comms and EMA and other, well, I guess those are the only two, right? We sold the trucks, so we don't have a facilities vehicle at this point. And are we just going to manage that independently, or what's the plan here? [1:36:58] Commissioner: We are thinking those eventually will go through Enterprise as well. They're just not currently up for replacement, and we have current funds available for this now, and it was a much better deal than going through Enterprise. [1:37:10] Chair: And as far as you said, you approached Enterprise regarding just maintenance, including this vehicle under their maintenance agreement, and they would do it for, what, $79? [1:37:23] Commissioner: Roughly $73 a month. So it's $20 a year. [1:37:26] Chair: A year. And it would be the same maintenance arrangement that we were going to have with the sheriff's office. I can't say [1:37:31] Commissioner: that for certain because we based ours on 15,000 miles driven a year, so it varies on depending on how many miles you drive for a year. Plus it's under warranty, so everything's covered for the first three years or four years, right? Correct. [1:37:45] Staff/Manager: We're likely not with that vehicle because how are we going to go with that on this program? Only because there are a lot of things that they don't cover where it's at, right? So, you know, break jobs, ties, those kinds of things would all be outside any maintenance agreement, so. [1:38:05] Chair: Okay, and we're not adding a car. We're simply replacing a current vehicle, and we're going to somehow get rid of the 104,000-mile vehicle. All right. We need to move, so I'm not sure we can take a vote at this point. [1:38:25] Commissioner: Andrew isn't taking a vote. All right. We have a motion and a second. [1:38:33] Chair: Any further discussion at this point? Okay. Yep. You want to call for the vote? [1:38:41] Commissioner: No, I'm going to put my hand up. [1:38:43] Chair: I'm not calling for the vote. Paul Traylor, AI. Okay. AI. Three I's. You've got a new card, though. No, don't say that, too. All right. Plan ceremony for communication tower upgrade completion, but it's not done quite yet. [1:39:09] Commissioner: Not quite yet, very close. We're thinking probably around the first week of November we can do it, maybe before the November commissioners meeting, if that would be. I'm hoping I'm going to be here for the 10th, but I'm going to be gone first week of November. You're gone too. We're going together in New York City. [1:39:36] Chair: But the meeting is the 10th. You're back the 9th. I hope I am. [1:39:40] Commissioner: We can do it after, but I mean, right now I'm still going to be here at the moment on the 10th, but I'm going to know in the next couple of days. Would you like to do it in conjunction with the commissioners meeting, tentatively schedule it then, tentatively? What's everyone thinking? Do we want to go to an actual site or have something here and buy towns? [1:40:04] Chair: I think it's more photogenic to go to a site. No? You don't care? [1:40:10] Commissioner: What's the most photogenic town to go to? I have no idea. Are we picking? Do you want to go to each one? We have three places. Well, I mean, I think that if we're going to open this thing up, it might be it might be worth going to east town to be able to take a picture with the board of selectmen, you know, and even if it was like a one hour thing where you basically start in one town and you go to each town and we just cut a ribbon in front of each one or something and then that's it, you know, somebody says a couple words, maybe the administrator of east town might say a couple words or maybe the chairman say a couple words up the town and then we'll invite, can I help you sir? Someone's looking for somebody, I don't know what they would prefer anyway, and then we can invite the press there and maybe we get possibly get the TV stations there because this is a big deal, we make sure we get good press released out a couple weeks in advance so that people can get on their calendar to be able to this, you know, this is a huge deal to be able to launch three towers, you know, in the county, no I [1:41:26] Chair: think that's I think that's that's right, I think and I and I think it's important to make sure that [1:41:32] Commissioner: and if you're doing the mornings during the morning like say 10 o'clock, possibly invite the Saginaw delegation, you know, the senator representatives, it'll be after the election, no right grab the election, so anybody that's coming in let them know, maybe invite the governor and see if we can, you know, make it a really, you know, because this is celebrating the other faculty, these are both on this to lower taxes for Saginaw County, I mean, the 10th might be a little aggressive so it might be better to do it around the 15th, you know, have our meeting on the 10th but do it a little later so we have enough time for so that, you know, they're actually make sure that they actually have accepted their positions, it might be worth it to make sure that they're up for a week or two before they're going, yeah, I would say maybe don't push it out of our meeting unless you're going to be regular way doing it the week following [1:42:38] Chair: the 10th would be certainly acceptable, I wouldn't get too close and I agree with Todd, let's make sure they're running but we have those insurances, well they are running [1:42:51] Commissioner: if we do something in the morning like at 10,.30, 11 that gives enough time for the news and then not do it on a Friday, do it on a Monday, Tuesday so that most people are around at that point [1:43:13] Chair: give any ideas to Jill [1:43:17] Staff/Manager: I was just going to suggest, if you're going to do one location, I'd really recommend West Bath because you would have adequate pocket in there because if you go to Georgetown or Pittsburgh, you're not going to have any pocket whatsoever. [1:43:33] Chair: We should do it with the select boards of those. [1:43:36] Commissioner: What happens if you started in the smaller towns and end up in the main event at West Bath? I was thinking about inviting, if you're inviting the press [1:43:46] Chair: by a police, a law enforcement officer. [1:43:49] Staff/Manager: Yeah, because they don't have Ample Pack at West Bath because of the arrest area there. [1:43:55] Chair: This could be a special sheriff's detail. [1:43:58] Commissioner: Well, it's a case of past if Jill could reach out to the administrators and see what they would like to do, because we could actually work with them and see if it may only be a couple of the board members from each of those smaller towns, but we're also looking at Georgetown, and maybe a handful of residents may show up. But I think it would be nice to be able to get a photo and maybe the sheriff's department could, you know, make sure somebody could come down and help us in case we have any issues with parking or traffic or whatever like that, you know, and be able to really get a good... And then we have to get, we need to borrow a shovel. Probably United Way has one or some people have a shovel, you know, not a shovel, but there's a ribbon and then like a big pair of scissors. I think the Brozick downtown has a pair and Bath might have a pair, you know. [1:44:46] Chair: I will echo Todd's comment. Let's just make, let's make sure they're running and stay running. Great. That's all. [1:44:55] Commissioner: No faith. Okay. Commissioner's comments. We have, we've actually have a new executive director is our director of Coastal County's workforce when I retired after 24 years and it was nice to see my colleagues and Jill at the annual convention that we had our annual meeting was held on September 11th in Freeport and it was a good send-off for Antoinette, and we're in good shape. Heather was our deputy, and she also started with the Job Training Partnership Act way back in the 90s before Governor King and some of us formed the workforce investment system. So it was great to see Antoinette be able to retire, and we're in good hands with Heather. She's on the program side of things for most of her career. Now she's the director, so she's kind of worn all the hats, since she has a good relationship with the Department of Labor. [1:46:04] Chair: Two Bridges Regional Jail Finance Subcommittee we have not met recently. [1:46:10] Commissioner: Todd? I attended the meeting at Sunday River, and the seminars I went to was protection of our IT system, the cybersecurity, Roosnik-Madigan LifeLight, risk pool loss control cost control, how do we control what we're wrecking, hr retirement services, and we had a risk pool meeting an mcsa board beaten, and they had another seminar on what counties do, which they really need to have that go to the towns so they can understand what we try to do, understanding the paid family medical leave act and supervisory personnel, the meetings I attended, and there was other means you wanted to go to, but the way with a timing was you some of them are at the same time, so you could make all of them, but it was very good, and we showed him how to play golf again. Your team won. [1:47:20] Chair: Did your team win? Oh, yeah. [1:47:23] Commissioner: Why not they lose? [1:47:30] Chair: Okay, thank you. Thanks, Todd. We do have a need for an executive session pursuant Title I MRSA Section 4056A to discuss personnel matters. We'll come back in the session. We don't expect any voting taken. Do we? There will be no vote taken. [1:47:50] Commissioner: Turn second, okay, we need a motion to come out of executive session, motion and a [1:48:16] Chair: second, all in favor, aye, motion to adjourn, motion and a second, all in favor, aye, thank you