Thomaston Planning Board Sets Workshop Schedule, Delays Sign Rules to January

[0:00] Planning Board Chair: What we're doing is trying to figure out, like we did last year, what do we want to take up when, which is going to take the most time. And I know that there's a group of people that are interested in the sign piece, so we want to make sure we schedule that at a time when they can come. So we don't schedule it on one of the Mondays when the sign board's meeting, obviously. So, that being said, looking at all these things, which ones did you then take out immediately so the ones that you're just [0:34] Planning Board member: to be aware of and do not need to go to the land use ordinance of our 1786 554 and 2116 those I wondered about them those are just for our knowledge yes [0:47] Planning Board Chair: they're sitting yeah but yeah the last so three essentially I read that one And so the last three, the 1786, the 554, and the 2116, those are all things to know about, but they don't go in the actual ordinance. So we will not be discussing them. That takes a few things off the plate. Not much, but a few. And then I don't know where we stand with CARA and the Select Board approving funding to have the resource protection actually professionally done so we [1:38] Planning Board member: have a grant for updating our land use ordinance yeah it does pertain to LD 2173 and 1829 okay I am unsure of whether or not we might be able to use some of that funding to assist with the resource protection designation stuff. I have reached out to Drummond Woodson. They have some really good ordinance writers there. And when I hear back, that is going to be one of my questions to them. [Planning Board Chair: Good. Okay.] Because if we're going to do such a big overhaul with the other stuff, I feel like that should be... [2:19] Planning Board Chair: Yeah, the resource protection, for those who aren't aware, it's all these little tiny wherever at some point when it rains a lot, there's a little bit of water trickles through something, they make that resource protection. We're in a severe drought. I doubt if you can find anything wet anywhere right now. But anyway some of it is definitely [2:39] Planning Board member: swampy and that's definitely [2:41] Planning Board Chair: but if you look in our ordinance it goes on pages and pages where each one is labeled like you know, RP 51 and it tells you exactly where it can be found. I made a few. [2:56] Planning Board member: Oh, okay. I'm sorry. [2:58] Planning Board Chair: No, in case somebody shows up. That's my fault. I didn't send the darn thing out. [3:03] Speaker C (unidentified): I know we're sharing one printer today, though. Oh. [3:06] Speaker D (unidentified): That doesn't help either. Sorry. I'm sorry. [3:11] Planning Board Chair: So anyway, so... [3:13] Speaker E (unidentified): The other thing about that, yeah, [3:15] Planning Board member: Is that we would definitely need to work with DEP to designate properly because there are certain characteristics that need to be present for things to be designated wetland. I think I don't know if it's going to happen this year. It's a really big deal. We need to have people come out and do field tests and things like that. [3:39] Planning Board Chair: That's why it needs to be professional. That's why we keep kicking it down the road. All we do, and we can still do it this time around, we can look at the uses and the conditional uses that is that is that car we can do which is what we've always done but the designation part and the actual longitudes and latitudes and all this kind of stuff that needs professionals [4:02] Planning Board member: That's all we put that one on till next year the RP okay well we still work with [4:09] Planning Board Chair: Neil Crane wants to put a green burial cemetery on his lot, which is in R2. And cemeteries are not traditional use in R2. They are only in R3 where the current cemetery is located, and R1, because that is so far out and about that it's the only area that would have enough land. That's what we thought anyway. But then he buys all that land by the river and he wants to put a cemetery on it. [4:47] Planning Board member: And I don't know about his proximity to the watershed. [Planning Board Chair: That's another problem.] I think that might pose an issue as well. [4:54] Planning Board Chair: There's no reason why he can't do a green burial in the current cemetery. I think he's seeing it as a moneymaker. [5:04] Speaker E (unidentified): What is a green burial? [5:07] Planning Board Chair: It's basically just wrapped up in a shroud and buried. [5:14] Planning Board member: I just saw this in Vermont there's a huge section of their cemetery [5:19] Speaker D (unidentified): In the town that is all mulched [5:22] Planning Board member: And turned over with hay and it's the composting lot for the grain burials it's pretty interesting [5:30] Speaker E (unidentified): I don't know much about it but if you put them right near the water wouldn't this affect things like the land industry [5:39] Planning Board Chair: Those are the things we'd have to think about [5:42] Planning Board member: And I'm sure that DEP has regulations on that [5:45] Speaker E (unidentified): Oh goodness, grandma just floated out into the lake [5:48] Speaker D (unidentified): We had a flood [5:54] Speaker F (unidentified): What's the time frame for a conversation [5:57] Planning Board Chair: He's going to come to some of the workshops I'm sure because he had other requests that he wanted to change things so basically we're going to look at R2 he's R2 we'll look at the uses and the other thing about R2 if you remember is the guy that wants to put the storage unit that's also R2 [6:16] Planning Board member: He also has resource protected area [6:18] Speaker D (unidentified): On the property [6:19] Speaker F (unidentified): And so that is [6:21] Planning Board Chair: Yeah, that's another issue. So because those are both R2, then we definitely need to look at R2 and decide do we want to add or do we want to take away some things for R2 because of the... And because the company has a plan, we cannot change the R2 on High Street to be R1, which we talked about. None of you were on board back then. You're all lucky. That was quite a go-around. And so we had wanted to change it to protect Montpelier by making it R1. They could not do some of the things that you can do in R2. And so that was our plan, and then we were shot down by the comprehensive plan folks, who basically had put in the comprehensive plan, there shall be no changes to R2. We can change the uses and that's about it. So given that, we will look at R2 at some point. [7:16] Planning Board member: So are we holding off on R8 and R2? [7:22] Speaker F (unidentified): Do you guys have to vote on that? [7:24] Planning Board Chair: No. We can decide if we want to hold off on the resource protection. [7:32] Planning Board member: I think that we should because it's a huge undertaking and we have another lots of [7:37] Planning Board Chair: undertaking. Okay. So that on here is I. So I'm going to put hold. I'm going to put hold for funding. Do we not even want to look at the uses and additional uses and... I mean we can look at... I mean we looked at them a couple of years ago. [7:57] Speaker D (unidentified): I suggested that we [8:00] Planning Board member: look at all of the permitted and conditional uses for R2, R3, R3A [Speaker F (unidentified): and R1] because we've got a lot of changes happening so I don't think it will make a huge difference to the resource protected area to the shoreland area [8:20] Planning Board Chair: that's the other thing, what do you want to do about the shoreland area [Speaker E (unidentified): that] That, because I know last year we talked about it, and Lindsay, and that's why I see you seeing her on the agenda. [8:32] Planning Board member: So I have our list from last year of all of the things that are kind of not zoned really correctly. And I think that we should look at conditional and... [8:52] Planning Board Chair: Initial and commercial? Conditional... [8:54] Planning Board member: that's all we have now and yes commercial we should look at conditional and permitted uses for that zone as well as what things are zoned in that area and how we how we can work to fix the zoning so that they're zoned appropriately yeah because there's housing in there that [9:14] Planning Board Chair: shouldn't be commercial so the whole thing needs to be redone yeah what is in there So, you see that as being... we've got to start putting some things in there, so what dates are we going to do what? When it comes to the signs, what was your biggest thing about the signs? [9:37] Planning Board member: I was recommending that we form an advisory panel, let's call it, that would give advice to anybody wanting to put a sign or maybe change some major exterior design feature of anything in the downtown area, initially anyway. And the idea is that it was just a strictly advisory panel that somebody who comes to and gets a permit for a sign or whatever that whilst that may be in compliance with the codes it's still perfectly possible for people to make something ugly that is compliant we know that and we've seen it and it wasn't very nice when the last time it happened and we've also seen mistakes that even have come from within in, like a misspelt Independence Day banner. Yeah, we all know that. Those things are easy to happen, and maybe the existence of an advisory panel would just help that not happen. I also think that the town is sometimes guilty of putting up signs and notices that are not as nice as they could be. And that's a personal opinion, but I think that everybody could benefit from an advisory panel. And the only thing I would say, and I'm trying to follow the model that's used in Rockland, which is that people are required, people that get a permit for a sign are required to at least consult with the panel, and they're not required to take their advice. But 99% of them do, because it's usually good advice and people can see the common sense. So I just use a way of maintaining standards around the downtown area, improving standards to some degree and doing it in a nice friendly way as a service really. And there are a bunch of professional designers and artists that I've already got several that are very prepared and like this idea and prepared to sit on such a panel because it would be important for instance that they could react quickly and not have people hanging around for decisions and so on. So it was discussed that. So it's not really [12:11] Planning Board Chair: changes to the existing ordinance size wise [12:15] Planning Board member: and otherwise. How would that workflow take place if I'm the person giving out the signing permits and then [12:25] Speaker D (unidentified): the advisory committee comes [12:27] Planning Board member: into play and they give the person these things. Do I grant the permits before that happens? [12:33] Speaker D (unidentified): Do I wait until after that happens? How does that all... [12:36] Planning Board Chair: Do you see that as having to be spelled out [12:39] Planning Board member: in the ordinance? Yeah, the model that I've seen, the people need to come back with the proof that they've consulted or maybe the pilot has to confirm to you that they've actually been consulted and then you I'm just thinking about the time stuff it gives me in respect to waiting for an advisory panel and not just using my ordinance. Right. [13:05] Planning Board Chair: So let's say I have a business. I need a sign. Number one, because the ordinance says you get the sign permits, I come in and see you. So step one is you ask for a permit. Step two, you advise them to go to the committee. [13:21] Planning Board member: Advisory committee, yeah. And [13:28] Planning Board Chair: then, so they can't get their sign until they've at least contacted the advisory [13:32] Planning Board member: and the advisory committee also has to know the sign ordinance inside and out well yeah, but you could grant, you could say okay, you're in compliance or you're not in compliance and then send them, so it's not we're not asking that committee to go in and if they come back to something and it's still not in compliance [13:49] Speaker D (unidentified): then I send them back again [13:51] Speaker C (unidentified): if it's not in compliance [13:52] Planning Board member: I'm going to be real here if it's not in compliance you say you send them to the design panel either way, but if it is in compliance, so it's in compliance but you do need just to take advice and that's where the, and then or it isn't in compliance, why don't you talk to the [14:11] Speaker D (unidentified): But does the advisory [14:14] Planning Board member: committee know the sign order now? Because they need to know. They're going to need to know. Yeah, I think they should [14:20] Speaker C (unidentified): know the sign order. [14:21] Planning Board Chair: Because if they advise to do something that is not in the sign ordinance, that person [14:25] Planning Board member: person comes back. That's my most major concern. They should be familiar with that and familiarize [14:33] Planning Board Chair: themselves with that. So you're not really looking at taking out or adding in any new kinds of signs. [14:40] Planning Board member: Have you read the sign ordinance? I have. Don't you have? I have read it, yeah. I'm not seeking to me I mean part of the thing was part of this thing was this to examine the sign ordinances and in workshops and discuss whether there could be changes [15:00] Planning Board Chair: so it's a twofold thing yeah number one is changing the existing sign ordinance or at least we're having it yeah well yeah you gotta do it and then number two is coming up with this committee yeah before elements double fake Ferris wheel [15:19] Speaker C (unidentified): key it's all that the sign ordinance to make sure that the signage is going to [15:24] Planning Board member: be right oh so what well that also brings us a good point times Ferris [15:34] Speaker D (unidentified): really if this is a committee is an official committee they also need their [15:43] Planning Board member: own by-laws and policy and yeah rules by which they govern themselves so [15:50] Planning Board Chair: which comes frozen chicken on the eggs does he create the panel and then we [15:54] Speaker F (unidentified): start this process because we've gotten so you can't create a panel with like [15:58] Planning Board member: The sign-off of the Select Board, well the Select Board, but when it came up in the Select Board they kind of throw it back to you guys. I know you, "This isn't our bag. This is really your territory." They tossed it back to us. What would be the time anybody... [16:15] Planning Board Chair: If it was mine, just me, because you tossed it back to me, I'd say, "We don't need a panel. You can go back to ordinance. Period." I'm just saying, if you toss it back to me, I don't have time to create panels. I don't have time to do anybody else's bylaws. I'm up to here already. The DAR, NAFAR, and Planning Board. And that's all I have. Yeah. So, if you're looking at, do you want an agenda, Neil? What? Do you want an agenda? Yes. Currently discussing signs. So, I mean, but having the authority, you're right, the Select Board has to approve this committee. Yes. Correct. We can't form a committee. We don't have enough review at all. It's nowhere in that book that we can form a committee. So if you want an advisory committee of any kind, you've got to form it and you've got to have the bylaws to go with it, so they don't just go off half clocked and they do this thing and somebody else, "Oh no, I like this one better." You've got to have some kind of rules. [17:25] Speaker C (unidentified): How does it work in Rockland? [17:27] Planning Board Chair: I didn't know Rockland had one. [17:30] Planning Board member: I can't remember what they call it, 's a historical, I can't remember the title, but it works in pretty much the way I said, people going for permits for anything in the downtown area. So you're only talking [17:43] Planning Board Chair: downtown, you're not talking somebody that's got a hairdressing [17:46] Planning Board member: album? No, I think this is a, you know, it's a trial kind of a thing. I think we would want to confine it, firstly the downtown area seems more relevant, but I would confine it to that, and then if a year or two down the line make some decision about whether we want to expand that thing or not, or whether it was a waste of time and we should wrap it up, or whether it was useful for the downtown and should stay for the downtown. [18:13] Planning Board Chair: What was the impetus to come up with this whole idea? Did somebody put a sign up that somebody didn't like? [18:19] Planning Board member: Yes. It started off, somebody put a sign up, very close to here, that was a temporary sign. But temporary is not very temporary, and it can be renewed very quickly so as to be permanent, practically, if you want. [18:37] Planning Board Chair: So that was temporary [18:38] Planning Board member: But I don't think that, I mean, there are two views about whether it was compliant or not compliant, but with that was the inspiration for it. And then, you know, it just seems that there were other things, there were other things getting put up that [19:00] Planning Board Chair: because I like the ones that, the ones that downtown has got, the new businesses and the block and stuff, they're fine. I mean, I never thought they have circular signs, but they're all consistent, they're all kind of cute, I agree [19:13] Planning Board member: but that's a lucky happenstance [19:17] Speaker C (unidentified): no, she would have made sure they didn't look ugly [19:19] Planning Board Chair: and she knows what the ordinance says [19:21] Planning Board member: well, I don't, that's the problem, honestly, I don't think, I think you can still be within an ordinance and do something pretty out of power but aesthetics aren't part of the ordinance in so many ways, says no, only just you can't have, me on, I can't tell, I cannot tell somebody you can't have that color because it's ugly, right, and nor can, nor can this advisory panel, but it can advise her to say sorry, like if you're talking to, and when you're talking to people that are for a living have been paid for their design talent and their knowledge of fonts and their knowledge of color and their, and, you know, when you get those people in front of you and they're just advising you, that's why most people in Rockland, 99% of people, according to the mayor of Rockland, just say, oh, thanks, that's a good idea. And they change it and they make it better. And we're talking here about stuff that's compliant with the codes. So nobody's getting forced to do anything except to actually take the step of consulting them about it. And they can still come back and say, [20:32] Speaker F (unidentified): no, I don't want to do that, I want my sign orange. [20:35] Planning Board member: Exactly, I consider myself a graphic artist, or whatever, or freedom of the individual, whatever they want to argue. If they want to, they can, they can go their own way. But most people don't. Most people see the sense in it. You know, it's just one thing, it's a fragile thing, and keeping the place looking nice without, you know, wanting to be, you know, over-policing it and so on. [21:00] Planning Board Chair: Well, the sign ordinance was done with the idea of keeping the downtown area looking to fit the buildings, the 1,800 buildings. So that you haven't got, I mean, I'll tell you, back in the 50s, back when all of a sudden you had these internal lit neon signs. I found they had the biggest, ugliest one I've ever seen. Anyway, they just hung out there and they were huge and they were big and they were and it did not go with the town. And so when they finally got rid of all that, 's one reason we wanted to make sure the signs kept the downtown looking the way, you know, to match the buildings. So it's not ugly. The only one that I consider to be ugly is the one that we'd like to get rid of. What is that? Anyway, and no names will be said. Anyway, and so that's why there's a certain thing in this is how much science can go on the glass and how much can be, you know... There's a reason for that, so it doesn't get to be like it was back in the 50s when they had discovered neon and everything was neon and... But anyway, so sometime in the 70s that all kind of went away. And so I understand what you're saying, but you're going to have to create your panel and your rules and regulations for your own panel, but you've got until March, you've got time to create your panel, get it approved by the select board, and you can tell them I tossed it back at you because we cannot, we don't have their purview, we don't have the authority, we don't have the authority to create committees, only the select board does. [Speaker F (unidentified): Wasn't the issue] Issue with the signs though, the waving, well those are safety issues, and I will, I will leave this panel before I'll let somebody bring those back in. I think, wasn't that part of the sign issue that people were bringing up, that they wanted us to look at? Yes, there is one particular, this is in town that wants the, they call them flutter signs or scooping signs. The ones that are on the big fiberglass poles and then the fabric comes down and it flops them. The U.S. Department of Transportation considers them to be a safety hazard. When we were doing the signs, when the board was doing the sign ordinance the first go around, I spent a great deal of time reviewing the state regulations, the federal regulations, and basically thought if the feds say that this is a safety issue then who am I to say it's not. And I do know in the towns that I just driven through, I fit down in Massachusetts where they still have humongous ugly billboards everywhere, and driving through that section of Route One that goes, you know, the insane section, I mean it's crazy, enormous great big signs, and you can't even and see the buildings next to it because they've got another great, big, enormous sign. And they're dangerous. So there are reasons why the sign ordinance is the way it is. It wasn't just we had a whim and decided we were going to do something. We spent as much time on that as we did on that Article 9 last year. [24:26] Speaker E (unidentified): Do we wait to hear back [24:27] Planning Board member: from the slight board to decide a date [24:29] Planning Board Chair: to watch out for? I would say we bump the sign one down to let them have time. [24:34] Speaker E (unidentified): So we will move that further down. As a small business myself I don't need signage but if you present this advisory board as you know a sort of a free session with the designer and because a lot of people who simply don't know how to make a sign so we're going to help I make one that will draw business to your like I mean even the one sign by the Thai food I just it looks like they're for sale the guy needs help I don't think it's the size I think it's what's on it and so if they get like a free consultation right that's how I would couch it that it's [25:19] Planning Board member: it's free advice and but you're required to at least listen to it you're not [25:25] Speaker E (unidentified): required to follow it but I think if you present it as because it costs money to go to a designer and have them work specifically with you, but if they can get it for free... Yeah, because I mean I think signage is ultra important. You've got how much time to make an impression on people. [25:45] Planning Board Chair: Yeah. Yeah. I agree completely. [25:50] Planning Board member: I mean, the select board [25:52] Planning Board Chair: should be happy to know that you were not... None of you guys were on the board back then. My gosh, such a change. Peter will remember, and Kim will remember, the town wanted to put a changeable sign at the end of Booker Street. And that's on Route 1. So you also have to realize that we have to abide by the Route 1 corridor sign. And so a changeable electronic sign for a business must be, according to what they have out there, our main DOT, within 600 feet of the business to which it pertains. So, of course, that couldn't happen. They weren't happy about it, but that's just the way it is. I didn't make that rule. But once you get the fire station in there, you can put one. [26:42] Speaker C (unidentified): You can put a [26:43] Planning Board Chair: changeable sign that says, Welcome to Thomaston, and the select board meeting is at this time, and planning board meeting is at this time. They always kept referring to the one in Wiscasset. The one in Wiscasset is in front of their fire station. So, I mean, that should make those people that wanted that sign happy, that once you get the fire station there, you can pull one. [27:04] Planning Board member: Well, as long as they come to the free advice panel first, make sure it's set into a nice, granite spot. [27:14] Speaker C (unidentified): Which is going to approve the design of the fire station first. [27:19] Planning Board Chair: Oh, they have got to come to us, and they know it. Yes,. Helen's going to help us. If you spend one penny on them, they'll drop them coming year. [27:29] Speaker D (unidentified): Okay, so we should put that at a later date. [27:32] Planning Board Chair: So signs move to what? November? No? Is November too soon for you to get your act together? December? We can do it in December or January. Let's do it in December. Let's put it in December. [27:43] Planning Board member: We can do it in January. Or January. Yeah, when we come back from the holiday. Yeah, I think. Does that work for you? [27:50] Planning Board Chair: Yeah, because November and December are kind of chopped up because... [27:53] Planning Board member: I mean, I guess there's plenty of time then to just get the Bible sorted out. Yeah. Okay, let's see. [28:00] Planning Board Chair: Because if I look at it, did I even fill in the one? [28:05] Planning Board member: After, I think our next one is January 4th or 2nd. If you have a list, it's the 4th, by the way. Okay, so. [28:15] Planning Board Chair: We could do it then. Okay, we're going to move it to January 4th. We'll move it to that workshop, okay? That gives you guys time to... And then if you need more time, let us know. That's good. [28:27] Planning Board member: Okay? Jan 4th. Yeah. [28:32] Speaker C (unidentified): Now that we know about Ellen's idea, whenever we look at the science, we'll have that. [28:38] Planning Board Chair: Yeah, now we know. Right? Absolutely. [28:42] Speaker C (unidentified): Good idea. The radical changes that we have in mind for science may influence Ellen's. [28:50] Planning Board Chair: we have better minds for changing time [28:53] Planning Board member: well actually that's a question sorry if you're reviewing sign ordinances [29:00] Planning Board Chair: because of the whole thing [29:02] Planning Board member: do you want to wait till then for that or do you want to be doing is that work that you'd rather [29:09] Planning Board Chair: oh it's fine put it on [29:10] Speaker F (unidentified): look at all we've got to go here [29:13] Planning Board Chair: we've got a bunch of state ordinances to do and all this stuff [Speaker D (unidentified): we didn't set] a date for the shoreland? No, we haven't. I want, just because I thought he had something [29:28] Speaker C (unidentified): To say, I want to make sure we get that to him. And I'm sorry, on January 4th, is that [29:32] Planning Board member: a workshop? Yes. Good, okay. Workshops. Four and six. Thank you. We have workshops on Mondays [29:42] Planning Board Chair: and Wednesdays. Yeah. And then we have our regular meeting. You can share it. [29:49] Speaker C (unidentified): Ellen, Alan, do you want to take a picture of that? [29:52] Planning Board member: This is the red card gates. [29:55] Speaker C (unidentified): The latest in red. [30:00] Planning Board Chair: I know they're out there, but they only put them out by month. They don't do them far enough in advance. So if anybody, Alan, if you know anybody that wants a list of when we have a workshop, let me know and I'll just email it to them. Right. [30:15] Planning Board member: Not a problem. I'm going to leave you to discuss the other stuff. Okay. [30:23] Planning Board Chair: Now I know Neil is here, because he wants some changes to the R2. [30:31] Speaker C (unidentified): Great ideas. Thank you, Alan. So [30:36] Planning Board member: that's in the letter C on our agenda. [30:40] Planning Board Chair: Rural residential R2 review permitted and conditional uses. Because if we were to add cemetery. Now we were thinking about this one thing. You're on the river. Where were you thinking of putting this? Anywhere near the river? [30:57] Speaker H (unidentified): Yes. But, oh,. Wait, everybody's shaking their head now. [31:00] Planning Board Chair: Well no, don't worry about DEP. [31:03] Speaker H (unidentified): Okay, but I've done a little bit of research on this. And I wouldn't put it, you can't put it within 100 feet of the river. I agree in some way. But I don't, you know, I don't know if this is, if there's rules on this or what. There's definitely rules. What? Definitely rules. Okay, so do you know what the rules on that? [31:19] Planning Board member: No, I have to look, but I know that you have RP on the back side of your property. [31:23] Speaker H (unidentified): Yeah, so I want to actually do it in the RP to get usefulness of that property instead [31:29] Planning Board member: of doing nothing. That designation probably shuts you right down completely. [31:34] Planning Board Chair: Yeah. Are you sure? Yeah. No, because it's too wet. You can't put a cemetery in the RP. [31:39] Planning Board member: I don't have to do serious research through DEP. [31:42] Speaker H (unidentified): It's like 40 feet. To me that's 40 feet high. [31:45] Planning Board member: Yeah, but you're at a tidal water zone. You have to be 250 feet away from natural high water. Okay. So that would put you back way far, and it doesn't I mean the slope. [32:01] Planning Board Chair: It doesn't matter what the slope is. [32:03] Speaker H (unidentified): At least it would be 100, 150 feet away. [32:08] Planning Board member: It would have to be more than that. I think so. But that is something, if you want to do research now is to look on the DEP website [Speaker F (unidentified): yes go to] the DEP website and look at resource protection and look at shoreline zoning rules and I'm sure they have a section pertaining to cemeteries [32:29] Speaker H (unidentified): yeah [32:31] Planning Board Chair: so that's your homework [32:33] Speaker H (unidentified): ok but so let's talk about R2 then [32:36] Planning Board Chair: that's where you are you're living in R2 [32:39] Speaker H (unidentified): So if I stayed back 250 feet. I'm sorry, you can't put it in that way. Except, I have a problem. Pardon? Doesn't your ordinance say something about it has to be 20 acres and I only have 19.79 acres? [32:56] Planning Board Chair: Our current cemetery, no, that was a crematory. A crematory can only be built, this is state law, that's why we ended up with one. State law mandates that a crematory can only be built in a cemetery consisting of, I believe it's 25 acres or more. It might be 20 acres or more. It's at least that much. And in the mid-coast, we were the only town that had a cemetery with that much acreage and that had a place where we could do it. That's how we ended up with a crematory. The ones that you find, like Van Gogh's, I've got one right downtown, and I'm sure there's a couple of other ones. But most of them, like Westbrook and stuff, they've got a crematory, and it's in one of their cemeteries. And you don't even know it's there. Like people don't know ours is there. They think it's somebody's house. Anyway, as far as private cemeteries go, I think five acres is the minimum. I did a little bit of research, but not much, because I had other stuff. [33:53] Speaker H (unidentified): Five acres of property? [33:56] Planning Board Chair: The cemetery has to be five acres. [33:58] Speaker H (unidentified): It has to be? [34:00] Planning Board Chair: I saw somewhere five acres. I did not look into it heavily. [34:04] Speaker H (unidentified): It has to be a whole five acres? That's big, that's big sometimes. [34:09] Planning Board member: I don't think you have to fill it all up, but you have to have that much land to start on. [34:15] Speaker H (unidentified): Oh, okay. And where would I find this? Is it in our... [34:19] Planning Board Chair: Go to state.gov, and I went out to maine.gov. So you go to maine.gov, and it brings up, I typed in cemetery. [34:30] Speaker F (unidentified): Okay. And that came up. [34:32] Planning Board Chair: There's a section on private cemeteries and municipal cemeteries and all that stuff, and so that's how you start to find out. But I can tell you right off the bat, I would not approve a cemetery in an RP zone. I just would not do it. [34:47] Planning Board member: Like I said, I don't know if DEP [34:49] Planning Board Chair: would allow it, but that's the other place you would go, again name.gov, and you would put in Department of Environmental Protection or just DEP, and up will come all their rules and regulations. So do a little homework on the main.gov site. I go there frequently. Let's see what you can find out. But I don't see it happening if you're planning on doing it in the RP. [Speaker H (unidentified): I don't want] you to spend your time and energy. I'm curious, and I'd like to ask somebody on the cemetery board, i.e. I'll ask your wife. [35:29] Speaker E (unidentified): If green burials are permitted [35:31] Planning Board Chair: In the Thomason Village Cemetery, I think they are. I don't think they're prohibited in the regular cemetery. I think there's a sunrise section. Pardon? Sunrise. Sunrise? They could actually designate a whole new section for it if they wanted to. They've got plenty of acres. [35:50] Planning Board member: Why don't you keep going? [35:52] Planning Board Chair: This is a moat. [35:54] Speaker H (unidentified): I'm interested in a five acre cemetery. That's for sure. Anyway, I'm just saying, [35:57] Planning Board Chair: look and see. All right. I mean, back in the 1700s, I mean, the Tolman Cemetery is an acre. That's it, one acre. And I know Acorn Cemetery, which is out in the same area, that started out as just a small... because his teenage daughter committed suicide. And they would not allow her to be buried in any of the consecrated cemeteries. So he said, all right, I'll create my own. So that's now huge. Anybody that's been to Acorn for a funeral, it's enormous. But it started out as a little... Where is that? That is, go out Lakeview. So as you're going out on County Road, just before you get to the Norea gas station and Route 17, there's a little road that goes off to the left. Some people take that to go into the gas station. Keep going down there. And on the left-hand side is a massive, big, yellow farmhouse. [36:48] Speaker H (unidentified): Is that the Acorn Cemetery? That's the Acorn Cemetery. [36:51] Planning Board Chair: Yeah, and that was the Acorn farm. And Michael Acorn, his daughter, committed suicide. side. And so he said, okay, I'll create my own cemetery. And he did. And it was very small to start with. It's his whole farm area is what it is. That used to be his very big farm. It's a cemetery. So there was a time when an acre was all you needed. And we all know you go out with a.32 going towards, oh God, going out towards Hussies and stuff. There's an actual little mobile home sits there in front of it, a nice little chain The same fence is three stones, because somebody had a family cemetery at one time right there. They're all over the place. Family ones. [37:31] Speaker H (unidentified): So what are the rules on a family cemetery right now? I don't know. Because nobody's asked for one. [37:38] Planning Board Chair: No, that's where... If you want to create a private small little cemetery, you need to find out the state rules. Because we don't have any state rules here. I mean, we say cemeteries are allowed in R3 because that's where the existing one is, and they're in R1 because when we did that, was the only place that had enough acreage for somebody to put in a big cemetery. [38:01] Speaker H (unidentified): But I'm in R2, right? You're in R2. [38:04] Planning Board Chair: So that's why it's not currently even allowed there. But before we get to R2, we've got a lot of other stuff to look at. So you do your homework on the cemeteries. All right. The GDP and all that stuff. And come back to us or let me know what you find out. [38:21] Speaker H (unidentified): So it's Mondays and Wednesdays for about two months. [38:26] Planning Board member: Well we're setting a schedule now until. [38:30] Planning Board Chair: Before March we have to be done by the middle of March because then we have to have public hearing and then the cycle has to have public hearing and then everything has to be ready to go to the town report before it goes to the town meeting in June. [38:44] Speaker H (unidentified): Ok thank you very much. Thanks, Neal. [38:49] Planning Board Chair: So the signs we put off to... Do we publish this? I gave it, and it's... She's got it scheduled, but she only puts it up as the week comes along, then it goes up. It's not listed like that for everybody. [39:09] Planning Board member: So once we figure out what dates we're doing what, we could just put an update. I can have her put an updated version on the website. Yeah. And just keep in mind. [39:20] Planning Board Chair: We have to be flexible because last year the bail and extraction ended up taking up months and do we think 1829 is going to take up. [39:30] Speaker E (unidentified): Months? Well, the hope. [39:32] Planning Board member: Is that someone gets back to me from the legal world. [39:36] Speaker D (unidentified): And we pawn this off on them and they write us. [39:40] Planning Board member: Okay, because I know for a fact that this ordinance. [Planning Board Chair: 1829 has been.] In 2173 have been written for other towns already so what I have been doing is track first trying to find lawyers then I'm going to go research and see what I can find out in the world of Maine somebody who has this ordinance we get an helper from that yeah we are absolutely so I'm thinking if we put this one off until December. [40:17] Planning Board Chair: Okay, so 1829 and 2173 put off until December. Okay. Got it. This one, 2149. Affordability of mobile home products. That really is an ordinance, is it? [40:36] Planning Board member: No, but I wanted us to look at it just to make sure it didn't, when we look at this, just to make sure it didn't have anything to do with anything. Okay because that 2173 changes things you guys remember mobile homes are now allowed in any zoning anywhere and I didn't know if they interacted in some way but okay to make sure they didn't I can look at that and 1981 is just the definition of tiny houses which I don't know if we had in our ordinance or not yeah because I have the I have the law right here we may not call it tiny houses well this is this is what the state considers tiny house and I didn't know right because some people ask. What is a tiny house and that's the law okay tiny home means. [41:38] Planning Board Chair: Means a living space permanently constructed on a frame or chassis. Chassis means it can be moved. It becomes a travel trailer. [41:49] Planning Board member: If it's registered, it says it all in the law. [41:54] Planning Board Chair: Anyway, it means a living space permanently constructed on a frame or chassis and designed for use as permanent living quarters, that A, complies with American National Standards Institute standard A119.5 on plumbing, propane, fire, and life safety, and construction on national fire protection. Association of Standard 1192 on plumbing, propane, and fire and life safety for recreational vehicles. [42:24] Speaker D (unidentified): Wait a minute. It is so valid. This is ambiguous. [42:29] Planning Board Chair: In one sentence it's saying it's a permanent living quarter, permanently constructed, and then they're going on to say that it fits the standards for recreational vehicles. [42:39] Planning Board member: Yes, it's very contradictory. [42:42] Planning Board Chair: It must have been written by a legislator. [42:45] Speaker E (unidentified): It must be. I thought a tiny house had to have a foundation. [42:49] Planning Board Chair: Oh, not according to this. [42:51] Speaker F (unidentified): Oh, here's a good one. [42:52] Planning Board Chair: It does not exceed 400 square feet in size. Does not exceed 400 square feet in size. Does not exceed any dimensions allowed for operation on a public way under this title and is a vehicle without motive power. Okay. I know what it is. It's like my friend has got this, she calls it peanut. It's her little tiny camper that she has. And it really is, it comes up around, it goes down like this, and it's tiny. She's got a bigger one. It's now more like the Brazil Monk. I saw that and I'm going, that thing is little. So that's, holy camoly. [43:40] Speaker E (unidentified): So you can have one on a chassis as long as you're not [43:44] Planning Board Chair: Oh wait a minute, this is even better. Tiny Home does not include a trailer. [43:50] Speaker F (unidentified): Wait a minute. A trailer vehicle doesn't have [43:56] Speaker E (unidentified): to be a trailer. A semi-trailer, [44:00] Planning Board Chair: a camp trailer, a recreational vehicle. Wait a minute. You just referenced recreational. It can't be a recreational vehicle or manufactured housing. Well, this one's going to be fun. [44:15] Speaker D (unidentified): This has been a law since 2020. Huh. [44:20] Planning Board member: This is what we deal with on a regular basis, code officers. [44:25] Planning Board Chair: Yeah, this was on our 29th May legislature. Later. And we just finished item 32nd. Right. Did they just expand on the definition this year or something? They didn't do anything. [44:37] Speaker D (unidentified): They haven't done anything. This is what has been in existence. And we didn't even [44:41] Planning Board Chair: know it. We were too busy with short-term rentals and accessory dwellings. [44:47] Speaker C (unidentified): What's the regulation say? [44:52] Planning Board member: The regulation says [44:53] Speaker D (unidentified): if it's not registered [44:54] Planning Board member: then it's a tiny house. If it's registered with the state of Maine I mean, it's a recreational vehicle. [45:03] Planning Board Chair: Right. Okay, so it's your job to go around town, and if you see a bunch of cars that aren't registered, it's going to be junk. So somebody, oh, no, this is not a travel trailer. [45:15] Speaker E (unidentified): It's a tiny house. Well, where's your registration? [45:20] Speaker D (unidentified): This is what I'm saying. [45:22] Planning Board member: This is what we deal with on a regular basis. So if somebody is living in a house, [45:26] Speaker F (unidentified): I mean, if somebody is living in a car, they just take the license plate off and then it's not registered in the house? [45:34] Planning Board Chair: Temporary registration is what we have. [45:37] Planning Board member: I mean, it's supposed to be 400 square feet. That changed with 2173, which made it 160 square feet that you can live in legally in a tiny house. [45:53] Planning Board Chair: That's not even big enough for a bed. [45:54] Planning Board member: What is 160 square feet in, like, a closet? It's like living in a car. [45:59] Planning Board Chair: It's like living in a car. [46:02] Speaker F (unidentified): Well, we were just talking. I know somebody who's living in a car. Yeah. [46:07] Planning Board member: Okay, then you've got provisions governing applications [46:10] Planning Board Chair: for a certificate of title for a tiny home. Oh, my Lord. Well, we definitely need to do something. Somebody's going to have one. [46:26] Speaker E (unidentified): One directly across from Fish Street is that too big to be a tiny home then or is that no [46:33] Planning Board member: Oh that gray one it can it can be any size the smallest size it can be is 160 square feet yeah [46:39] Planning Board Chair: No this one says does not exceed 400 square feet right so 160 to 400 yeah so that little the gray one is more than 400 square feet I think. That's like an ADU. I mean it's cute as can be but [46:59] Speaker E (unidentified): That's what I think of as a tiny home and I guess it isn't. I guess it's not. [47:03] Planning Board Chair: It's a small home. Is it [47:08] Planning Board member: Menschal? There we go. I can see a question on your face. [47:15] Speaker C (unidentified): What's your question? Just which home we were talking about. The one right across from the street. [47:20] Planning Board Chair: It was orange for a while, then it got painted gray. I forget what it was originally. [47:26] Speaker C (unidentified): It was really cute before the lot became completely... [47:30] Planning Board Chair: All of a sudden there's a lot of pickup trucks in there, and the skeleton's never left from last Halloween. He doesn't have to worry about doing it again this year because it's still there. [47:40] Speaker C (unidentified): The Center for Furniture Craftsmanship used to rent it for... For what? For building visiting faculty. Oh, really? Stuff like that. I didn't know that. [47:52] Planning Board Chair: Anyway, there's a handyman sign out there all the time now. And that gives me another one. [47:57] Speaker F (unidentified): That's not a temporary sign. [47:58] Planning Board Chair: It's been there every single day for the last year. Yeah. Yeah. [48:05] Planning Board member: The S&P or something. It's something. Yeah, I know what you're talking about. By all the Halloween decorations. [48:12] Planning Board Chair: It's a sign there, but it's been there forever. So it's not a temporary sign if it's forever. I didn't notice that the restaurant took our advice and does the sandwich board thing, but he doesn't use bold colors or anything. You gotta get right up on it, and it's just regular black marker on white. He definitely needs the design team because he could come up with something catchy, even if he just puts a picture of bubble tea on it, which was his big thing. [48:45] Speaker E (unidentified): Really nice, I'd love to see him succeed. Yeah, but the signage doesn't. No, yeah. [48:55] Planning Board Chair: Wow, this is fascinating on the tiny home. Hmm, I wish I felt that way about it. You've got to get a certificate of title for a tiny home. [49:06] Speaker C (unidentified): Do you have to have an occupancy permit? [49:10] Planning Board Chair: That's what I'm saying, yeah, register this. Do you have, wait a minute, do they have to get an occupancy permit? [49:17] Planning Board member: From yeah, so if they are building a tiny home in an actual one without a registration, they need to do all of the same code already, a bunch, just like a regular regulation building permit, and I'll give you all the everything. [49:32] Planning Board Chair: Everything, so do we need to incorporate this more than just in the definition? [49:38] Planning Board member: That we need to actually put it somewhere, and I feel residential section, it should be in the updates with the 1829 and 2170. Okay, so it's not so much that it's, it's really developing the electrical manner, keep keeping it up to code, making sure that it's code compliant, not going under that 160, 60 square feet, and that's following the density requirements, so everything else. [50:18] Planning Board Chair: Has to do, so this one 1981 tiny house, you think it should be included when we're doing 1829 and okay, so we're going to throw that in with that one then, it's. [50:40] Speaker F (unidentified): December, so I think this might take all of December. I think so, because December. [50:45] Planning Board Chair: We shortened because of Christmas, five meetings, yeah, five meetings December, okay, we're going to knock that out in December, okay, would you like your tiny. [50:55] Planning Board member: Any house stuff back, or unless you want to keep it, I know right where it is. [50:59] Planning Board Chair: I shall keep it, okay, who's that first, I don't know, but let me go to December, okay, so we went to LD 1829, 2173, and 1981, that was a good year. [51:27] Speaker D (unidentified): That's December, and the 997 is the act to allow residential use. [51:35] Speaker E (unidentified): We don't prevent it now. [51:37] Planning Board Chair: Commercial districts. [51:38] Planning Board member: Well, there's nothing in our ordinance about it currently. [51:42] Planning Board Chair: I don't believe there is. [51:49] Speaker D (unidentified): But do we want to say it? [51:51] Planning Board Chair: We need to come out and say it, so that's basically. [51:58] Planning Board member: And I don't feel like this is a huge deal. [52:01] Planning Board Chair: Because right now, Village Commercial already has housing and funds for any one of those buildings. [52:06] Speaker D (unidentified): And this is, like, legitimately a one and a half page law [52:13] Planning Board member: that just says you're supposed to allow it if somebody is seeking it. So like, residential units in areas... [52:23] Planning Board Chair: we can have it okay conditional use in the highway commercial apartment building eight units or more isn't that residential housing that is residential properties building eight units or more is allowed not limited to buildings that are vacant are particularly vacant retail property oh like a shopping mall yeah that's they're doing that frequently [52:46] Planning Board member: turning an old Kmart into apartments natural hazards are in the zone building to be unfit for residential use so that's really gearing more towards [53:09] Planning Board Chair: It was refitting of an existing building. [53:10] Planning Board member: Right, and we don't have any empty storefronts. [53:17] Speaker F (unidentified): So it's up to you guys. [53:19] Planning Board Chair: Okay, so we currently have an apartment building. Eight units or more is allowed in the highway commercial. Okay. If you feel we should put in there, but wouldn't that be under the renovations of existing structures? That comes under residential, conversion of existing residential structures. We could put something like conversion of existing commercial structures, and put that where? I mean, we could just take out residential, conversion of existing, take out structures. And so we've got apartment buildings, and that's got bed and breakfast, and rooming house, business professional office and health services and that's all things that you can take an existing residential like they did on Booker Street [54:25] Planning Board member: just a residential slash commercial that covers [54:30] Planning Board Chair: and that way it can be an apartment building, it can be a bed and breakfast it can be a rooming house I thought we took rooming house out [Speaker F (unidentified): that's an antiquated] village commercial rooming house yes yeah rooming house it's kind of like a B&B but I guess rooming house doesn't feed you breakfast [54:55] Planning Board member: it was back in the old days [54:58] Planning Board Chair: I got hostile my rich is rooming house [55:05] Planning Board member: down at the poor farm okay [55:09] Planning Board Chair: we can look let's do this let's revisit okay so that is which one was that was okay that was 997 okay let's do 997 under the residential [Speaker C (unidentified): which is 719] which is residential and revise 719.2 to read I mean that would be the easiest one we've done. Residential slash commercial. [56:00] Speaker D (unidentified): Perfect. Yay, we've got one done tonight. [56:04] Speaker E (unidentified): I can fix that. [56:05] Planning Board Chair: I mean, but do we want to add anything other than what we've got for those conversions, which is the apartment buildings? I think that [56:15] Planning Board member: covers it, and then if it ever comes up, it will be built within that time. Yeah, because [56:24] Planning Board Chair: In the highway commercial now, they can build an existing home building of the eight apartment units or more. That's perfect. And if Walmart goes out of business, that would be on heck with the department. [56:34] Planning Board member: And I wasn't sure about 427. But I'm pretty sure we already have this in here. I just wanted to... And I can't regulate my municipal parking space minimums. [56:47] Planning Board Chair: Oh, we were thinking about that because somebody complained that they had to put so many parking spaces in. Oh, that was back with Walmart. [56:55] Speaker F (unidentified): But they don't have to... [57:00] Planning Board Chair: Do you have this? It's not a parking section. That's the law. This is the law. For purposes of this section, parking agreement means a legally binding agreement between a property developer and the owner of an off-site parking facility. We don't have off-site parking. [57:24] Planning Board member: Like a parking garage or anything like that. Parking garage. I was [57:31] Planning Board Chair: going to say, that could be a conversion of an existing commercial building into a parking garage. Should we add that to 719? [57:41] Speaker F (unidentified): Let's not have any parking garages. [57:44] Speaker H (unidentified): We don't want any parking garages. [57:46] Planning Board member: We don't want any parking garages. Okay. [57:48] Speaker C (unidentified): Nine by 18 feet. [57:51] Planning Board Chair: Facility required parking spaces within 25.25 miles of development. We don't even allow off-site parking. If you're developing a store, you've got to have on-site parking, period. That's it. So that's out. Limitation of minimum parking space requirements in the growth area. [58:14] Planning Board member: That, I think, deals also with the – they only have to have the one parking space for a residential place. [58:21] Planning Board Chair: Yeah, we already got that in there. And we already have that. Yeah, a municipal may not require more than one off-street parking space for a dwelling unit for a residential development within a designated growth area of a municipality. We've already said our growth area needs to be changed. And then I've got to run up to the issue of can we change it if that's what was designated by the comprehensive plan? I think, yes, we can. Okay. I like your thinking. [58:45] Planning Board member: I think we can because the comprehensive plan, like I said, it doesn't match up. And legally, the growth zone has to be where there are utilities. There's got to be. There has to be public water. Or there has to be the ability of the town to move them into that space. [59:01] Planning Board Chair: Yeah. And every time it's come up, over the years, over the last 20 years, every time it's come up, it's too much money. I mean, they spent almost half a million dollars getting it out to the end of town so that the East End could be developed. It used to end at Kirk Hill. Everybody out my way, it was all wells and everything. And so there was nothing. You had Dave's Restaurant, you had the Junkyard, you had Dorman's Ice Cream, and that was it. Because there was no water and there was no sewer. So the town voted to put it in and took out a bond and everything to do it. I think the bond's paid by now. But again, it would have to be. And now it would cost probably five, ten times that to run it out. Because if you go out the growth area, which is out Beachwood Street area, where it's all wet, that's definitely our peak. Then you get out to Ashland Drive and they're all on wells and septic, and everybody who lives out there is on wells and septic. So to make that the growth area, and when we talked with John Fancy about it. The issue is if you continue, maybe water won't go there, we don't even control that, but anyway, if you're going with the sewer lines you've got to go down the hill, Icehouse Hill, and to get a pumping station big enough at the bottom of Pumped Hill, of Icehouse Hill, to pump it up is going to cost millions. So John did have a good idea, which is coming from basically the soil treatment plant, coming across the land, which is owned by the town, and then getting right of ways from the people to go across, like Seacans would have to give it, because he has Murray's Avenue. He has land out beyond there. And the George Hall. And anyway, to come across there and connect that way, and to just pump it flat across would not cost as much. So I thought that was a genius idea. And that was back when they were thinking of putting affordable housing in the TR3 area, out there. And then when they got out there and looked, it doesn't take a genius to look at, it's all swamp. It's all full of red twig dogwood bushes. And they like water. Anytime you're driving anywhere, wintertime, summertime, no matter when, if that's what you see, and it tells you right now that is water, period. And so that's when that came up, nothing. But his idea of bringing the line across would still work, even if they didn't put a development right there. If they got it to Beachwood Street, then that would be the potential. Make that the TR3. There's a stance now. It's not viable. I mean, Brooks did the Ashland Drive one, and it sat empty for eight years because people couldn't afford to pay his price for a lot and then put in their wells and their subject. So we need to look at that whole idea. Okay, so back to the looping at parking in the growth area. I think we already addressed that last year when we redid the housing thing. Yes, that piece we did, yes. I think we've done that. Off-street parking, again, we don't have it, and we don't want it. [1:02:41] Planning Board member: So we can throw that one out the window then. Whatever happened with the parking at the carriage house? [1:02:47] Planning Board Chair: Well, that's still a tussle. That's nothing. [1:02:51] Speaker E (unidentified): I had to reach out to Jess [1:02:52] Planning Board member: at some point and ask her if she could put up signs to not block driveways and... [1:03:00] Planning Board Chair: And did she do that? [1:03:02] Speaker F (unidentified): Thomas Student Federated Church was offering the use of our parking lot now that it's repaved for them. [Speaker C (unidentified): Well, I mean...] And it's one block. [1:03:13] Planning Board Chair: I know. And they can park on Main Street. [1:03:16] Planning Board member: They can park across the street. [1:03:17] Planning Board Chair: In the evening, they can park on Main Street and walk down. They can park behind the business block and walk down. [1:03:24] Speaker F (unidentified): I thought the problem was crossing Route 1 at night. [1:03:28] Planning Board member: I don't think it's a big problem. [1:03:30] Planning Board Chair: But now with the big flashing thing, all you've got to do is push the button. Boy, you can tell from... I mean, I don't know if anybody's been out past here walking in my name, [1:03:38] Planning Board member: but Tom's pretty dead. [1:03:41] Speaker F (unidentified): I'm just thinking of traffic. [1:03:43] Speaker D (unidentified): It's 7 p.m., 6 p.m. [1:03:46] Planning Board Chair: All the streets are all up and up and gone at 6 p.m. This is shuts down. Okay, I think we're okay with this. I think we're fine with 281. I think you can trick it to it. [1:03:59] Planning Board member: Yes, I will. [1:04:01] Speaker D (unidentified): I have not spoken. [1:04:04] Speaker H (unidentified): I'm sorry, it was the doctor's office. [1:04:06] Planning Board Chair: It's okay, don't worry about it. So which one was that one? [1:04:09] Planning Board member: That was 4.27, so we just crossed that right off. [1:04:14] Planning Board Chair: You're doing good tonight. I was thinking of making this only an hour. It's already 6 o'clock. Is that okay? And I can revamp this thing and take things out. We've got stuff scheduled in December and January, so that's good. And I will take care of 997 and have that all ready for us. Okay. Okay. And I think we were correct in asking Alan to do his due diligence on this whole committee thing. And then Neil really needs to do the investigation on us. I don't have time to do everything. [1:04:49] Planning Board member: None of us do. Not all right now. [1:04:51] Planning Board Chair: And, okay, so let's call it quits for tonight. And, let's see, you guys will be here tomorrow night for a meeting. Oh, you won't be. No, I know. You've got nothing, but that should be quick. It's so happy that one short term, just short term. I'm just the one. We will not discuss any workshop stuff because [1:05:14] Planning Board member: I don't be on Wednesday. No, it's new resident night, this one. That's right. [1:05:21] Planning Board Chair: We're not doing. I have to be at the new residence, so we don't have one Wednesday. So what's the next one? The next one is next Monday. It's what [Speaker C (unidentified): it's on 28th.] So that's what Monday. So the next one is Monday. [1:05:37] Planning Board member: We all have to sit in the gym and talk to new residents. [1:05:43] Planning Board Chair: Welcome the new people and tell them all the wonderful things we can tell them. [1:05:47] Planning Board member: And what services we offer as a municipality. [1:05:50] Planning Board Chair: Nice. We all have a lot. [1:05:55] Speaker F (unidentified): I'll see what I can tell our neighbors to come. [1:05:58] Planning Board Chair: Yeah, tell your neighbors to come. [1:06:00] Planning Board member: It's good for people because they do. I mean, we just give them information like how do I register my car. [1:06:06] Speaker D (unidentified): How do I register my dog. [1:06:07] Planning Board member: You can do that. [1:06:12] Planning Board Chair: By walking into the town office when Missy was here. Exactly. We need to turn this off because we're done Monday's workshop.