Bangor homelessness committee reviews warming shelter plans, Project HOPE status

[0:23] Teal Vasquez: You are live. All right. Well, with that, it is 5.15. We will call this meeting of the Advisory Committee on Homelessness to order. I hope everyone received the packet and had a chance to look through it. Starting off, so part of the feedback we've received from folks is they're not always able to hear or understand who's speaking. So the first agenda item is introductions. I will go first. My name is Alton Buzzel. I am the chairperson of the committee, and I am the director of marketing for Hollywood Casino. We will go to my list. [0:55] Amy West: I am Amy West. I'm a nurse practitioner and the clinical director of wellness health services for PCHC. [1:04] Ben Treat: I'm Ben Treat. I'm the director of the Bangor Public Library. [1:07] Brittney Dunham: I'm Brittany Dunham. I'm one of the senior directors of social work for Preble Street. [1:11] Carolyn Fish: I'm Karen Finchley. So I'm from the Bangor City Council. Hey, everybody. I'm Jason Goodrich. I live in Brewer. [1:19] Teal Vasquez: Hi, my name is Teal Vasquez. I am part of the Outreach and Recovery Community here in Bangor. [1:26] Melissa Ann Rhodes: I am Melissa Rhodes, and I am the Director of Participant Management for Bangor House. [1:31] Teal Vasquez: Awesome. So with that, the community has all introduced themselves. We will move on to updates. The first update is updates to the warming shelter. So I don't know, Bruce, what do you provide there? There we go. [1:45] Robyn Stanicki: So we met just last week. The Brick Church will be opening on the 15th and be opening until April 15th from 4 p.m. to 7 a.m. And they'll be serving dinner at four. The Mansion Church will open on the 15th also to March 31st, which is one that didn't get funding. So but they still will be opening and I know that's kind of the questions we had last week and then the Together Place we are working through funding and logistics to try to open that up for the coldest nights of the year and also snow or freezing rain so as it stands right now [2:30] Teal Vasquez: Now, how many beds do we anticipate having open? [2:33] Robyn Stanicki: So they are, yeah, the Brick Church can take up to 70 people, and then the Mansion can take 25, and then Boyd will have an extra five mats also for the winter. [2:50] Teal Vasquez: So how close does that get us to? [2:54] Robyn Stanicki: So the highest that we had last year was 125 that came into the shelters, and that was on the really coldest nights, but our average was around 85 to 90. We should be all right. Yep. [3:11] Carolyn Fish: Can I ask a quick question? [3:13] Amy West: You said the 15th, not the summer? [3:15] Robyn Stanicki: November 15th, yeah. [3:19] Teal Vasquez: Any other questions regarding forming shelter? [3:24] Brittney Dunham: Is there a policy yet on – or is the policy being created for the Together Place threshold? [3:30] Robyn Stanicki: Up, I just have to say that is not guaranteed. We are presenting this to city council tomorrow during workshop, so this is something that's still being presented, needs to be discussed and agreed upon, Jason. [3:45] Teal Vasquez: Do you have a question? Can I see you on that side? Any other questions regarding forming shelter? [3:55] Speaker J (unidentified): I have one follow-up. [3:56] Teal Vasquez: I believe I have a good format for your policy for when the kind of place should open its gates. [4:03] Robyn Stanicki: Yes, we have very sort of close friendships with people in Portland who did run as a weather-operated. A lot of lessons learned from that, so we'll be taking their policy, making some adaptations so that it works for us. And, you know, of course, one of the most important parts is that communication happens, so that if the shelter is open, we have a good communication plan. If it's not open, we have a good communication plan. But again, the first step is to bring this in front of city council tomorrow. Do you have [4:40] Speaker K (unidentified): a question? Yes, I do. [4:42] Peter Patrick Kealy: Go ahead, Pat. Well, I had just gotten here. I was going to ask real quick for a catch-up. [4:48] Teal Vasquez: So we've just talked through the warming shelter plans this year, and it sounds like we've got enough beds to cover the average night. Somebody correct me if I'm wrong. [4:57] Robyn Stanicki: But there is a part of the nation to take that hope people are coming, you know, you just, I guess you can't really get a good number right now, I would say to be honest, people are couch surfing right now, people are squatting, you know, when it gets colder and those things aren't, they don't have the ability to do that. I don't spend my eyes up a little bit based on the last year, last year's numbers. We, yes, and I mean that's, that's, that's well and good, and that's, that's great for everyone [5:26] Peter Patrick Kealy: with like two spaces and one overflow, like with behaviors and like personalities and stuff like that, like, and I get that the proximity with the brick and the together place and stuff, but for people to have different options, not only for themselves, right, but for the staff on the other side, right, I don't know if anyone can really quite grasp, you may be able to deal, how important it was to have the brick, the communication, and I'm obviously pretty biased, I work at the together place, right, but it's A part-time job, I also work for overdose response. I mean, I'm out there, and there are people, there's other people sitting at this table that like, we're, we're gonna be, wants to find them, us, right here, me, right, would be one of them. I had another person who runs one of these teams come up to me today, right, not runs, but let me just, another person that runs one of these teams begging me, like, gosh, that may not be enough, right? We can't get real accurate counts. I mean, we're out there waiting in the woods sometimes up to our hips, and every time we come up on a quiet tent, you never know. I, again, me, very middle of the road, fiscally responsible, all that stuff, right? But this is human life, right? And I just want to make sure we're all checking everything and everything's all good. Because back a few years ago, it seemed like human life is worth a little bit more, right? At least in conversation, at least around the dinner table or around the whatever. Cause that's at the end of it, right? Not only are these people that are out there, right, you got people like us that are fresh out of it, trying to bring people back out, sweeping the beach, baby, sweeping the beach, right? But it's good. We need that. We need all we can get. Because once people are dead, they're dead. And they don't get to come back at 41 years old in a different city to start over and bring life-saving medication to people. People, you know, and I'm not trying to like soapbox anything, this is just coming out, this is what's going on out there. I was, I just could, I could go on. I just want to make sure our people are safe, but in the best way. I saw the other week myself, my own, twice, somebody be no trespass from life in Bangalore. How is that helping anyone? Like, dude, guys, we gotta do better, we gotta come together on some stuff, right? Because that's what's going on. We just lost a 26 year old kid. I mean, this is personally me, I'm telling you this, right, this stuff's gotta, we gotta come together, we gotta stop making sense of some stuff, and I mean, and we gotta get a question. Don't question where the money's going. Don't question if it should be being spent, right? And again, I'm sorry, I don't know where that all came from, but it's been a long month, it's been a bad month, guys. So, and anyone out there will tell you, it's been a real rough, year. This is the worst it's been in a bit, right? At least from my perspective, what I'm seeing out there, 's been a lot. And that's the reality check from the streets right there. Sorry. Sorry. As we were here. [9:02] Teal Vasquez: That's why you were appointed, because you bring that perspective to this committee. And I think you articulated it very well. And I think right now what we're trying to do is just make sure we have that baseline, right? And that's where making sure that we have the beds to cover at least the minimums from what we had last year. And then let's try to expand that, right? But let's make sure we've got something. Absolutely. Before we, sorry. [9:28] Brittney Dunham: What will be the capacity of the Together Place if it's able to open on cold nights? [9:36] Teal Vasquez: So that puts total beds on the coldest nights. [9:39] Robyn Stanicki: Up around that 125. [9:43] Teal Vasquez: Before we move on from the warming shelters, I just have to say, I mean, I can only go from vibes because, you know, like we've all said, you know, it's hard to really get a final count on what our needs are. until we've experienced them but as probably the only person at this table that I would have to guess you know was really working the shelters intensively last year I mean I was pulling doubles or triples trying to hold it down and even though Together Place did an admirable job and all the people from Sanctuary did an admirable job it was very chaotic and it was fire and brimstone And even though we had the communication with our partners, often what we would hear from them, you know, we get a call from them, it's fire and brimstone on their end. So the idea that, you know, we're just barely touching the average horrifies me because there were many nights where I turned people away. And personally, I don't feel like the city is doing enough to hold the hand of these people who are keeping our people alive. I mean, there were times where I was pounding on the chest of someone, giving them CPR, and I wasn't given, not because Together Place didn't have an interest, not because Sanctuary didn't have an interest, but the tools were handed to me to be ready for that situation. But I, you know, I did what I could, and I know that a lot of other people, especially at these warming shelters, are going to be put in that position again. And if we could just enter into my dream world for a bit, you know, the city would have guidance or tools for these people running the shelters for de-escalation so that we could reduce the acuity before it happens, and we could reduce these, you know, trespasses and CTs and bans because it is so abundant. And that's what I spent half my time doing. I didn't even get to spend half my time serving the community. I spent half my time litigating CTs and trespasses and calling different places and saying, hey, what can we do to change this? You know, I'm with this person and right now they're calm. I've worked with them all week, they're calm, and it seems like it wouldn't be that hard for, or at least it's worth the undertaking for the city to create guidance, or anyone to create guidance on de-escalation, pay for that training. I mean, I know that we're trying to be fiscally responsible, but we're going to be fiscally responsible into the loss of life pretty soon. And like, I mean, it was sort of the same conversation last year where we said there's enough beds on paper, and it turns out there weren't. Like, I was turning away people every other day, and I not only was I doing that, but because I have the communication and sort of office skills, that was sort of one of my roles there. It was my job to network between the other shelters, and they didn't have a bed either, or that person was banned, or five other things, you know, not enough volunteers to accept anyone. Like, they've reduced their capacity because there's not enough volunteers today. There were not enough beds last year even though there were beds on paper, and sometimes it wasn't that I was turning away one person, it was that I was turning away six people at once. So yeah, and I mean, I think that's kind of what you were getting there, is that like, we are adding ourselves on the back about the number, but the number was not. So I do want to be clear, I don't think anyone's patting themselves on the back of the number. What we're trying to do is make sure that we have the information that's currently available, we understand the current status of the situation, so that this committee can help make recommendations to improve. These are updates. These are for us to get the information from the city. So we have that information, that baseline, so that we can make those recommendations. How do we get better, right? We can't get better if we don't know the current situation, and that's what the updates are being provided right now give us. So we have that information as a committee so that we can move forward and improve the situation. Jason, I know [13:54] Speaker K (unidentified): you had something. I do, I have a couple of, a couple of questions and some comments. I think mine are more about the system of warming center, the warming center system of care that we have in Bangalore. I'd like to start thinking about it in that way. If we can, I have a document that I created to respond to the agenda for today. And it's got a couple of different purposes. I'm going to pass out right now. And ask you to go to page five. The only one I'm going to talk about is only two pages out of the 15. So it shouldn't take too long. There's stuff, there's enough for everybody in the back as well, I believe. Developing a coordinated and countable warming systems, warming center system, the overall goal was to move mango from a collection of seasonal warning center programs towards a coordinated system with defined capacity, common standards, consistent data, accountability, predictable funding, and a clear relationship to the broader homeless response. I've actually presented you with set with six goals. One of them is what we're doing right now, establish the baseline, talking about baseline right now as we're discussing. Number two is to find Bangor's warming center needs. I think we're talking about that now, but we'll have to continue with that one. Here's where the goals get a little bit long on the second page, number six. I'm suggesting that we establish common warming center standards, that we actually meet with warming center providers to set up a set of standards, a universal set of standards, what would people, what can people expect when they come into a warming center. And then I'm suggesting that we connect those common data, we establish common data and accountability, we talk about what our metrics are, what we want to continue to, measure for the next following season, what are, what are the data points that We want to measure along with what the COC and Main Seat Housing is measuring and the SEC. The fifth goal is connecting that city support to agreed upon standards. Once the providers have agreed and the city have agreed, connecting those standards to some type of agreement so that when the city does decide to pay for warming centers outside of the main state housing funds and there's a set standard like a contract, they would have a contract that says you have of the staffing ratio, you have a training need, you have on hours of operation. You'd be able to actually set that up because some type of contact, it's a contract that could also be used with all of the warning centers. They would, they would sign the contract and make the agreement to receive the letter of support that they would get each year [16:58] Teal Vasquez: when they, when they grab fun. So Jason, I don't want to catch up, but I do want to make sure that we be maintained to the agenda. I know you spent a ton of time on this document. I'm not going to let this go, and no, I don't want you to, but I also want to make sure that community members have an opportunity to really review it, right, absolutely digest, because you've spent a lot of time here and it warrants that attention. I want to make sure that it's included in a future agenda item so that we can get in, and again, you have some great points that I think will piggyback back off of the things we have in today's agenda that we can kind of use this document in conjunction with the document that we're going to review in a minute. So thank you for that time, but in lieu of time, I do want to make sure that we get through the entire agenda. Counselor, you had [17:46] Carolyn Fish: something as well? Yes, and I think this question for those of us that is ingrained with the homeless outreach, I think even us on council or some of the viewers, how it was a little confusing when I saw that the Mansion Church didn't get any funding this year and they did last year, and it seemed that the funding I saw for the Brick Church seemed pretty hot. It was like four hundred thousand dollars or something in my right rooms in that capacity, and I wondered why that was, and maybe that falls along with Jason's recommendations that if we could work with some of those that have experience in what in the one of these doctors what the spirit is for, I don't know, for better application or better positioning when they say, no, this comes out. I'm just confused when I saw 400 and something in the ancient church guidelines. [18:39] Robyn Stanicki: Both me and Jen, we've been meeting all summer with the warming centers, and we came up with the same thing that you're asking. We told them that maybe the city could apply for that and we could disperse it to all the warming centers and try to work that way so that everyone would have a piece of financial part in it. And they all said they got it. They all came back to us and said, nope, we're good. We're going to put our own applications in. And they did, and that's how it came back. [19:12] Brittney Dunham: And for clarity, because the money is not being awarded for the city. The money is being awarded for Main Street. [19:18] Robyn Stanicki: And I would just add that the 400 and something thousand seems significant. And it's the most that was received, if you look at the number of beds that the mansion is, I'm sorry, the brick church is offering, it gets down to about $44 a day, a bed per night. And that does meet the average that the state has supported in the past. So that's how often that number is calculated by number by, but as Bruce mentioned, we've been working, Jen Lawler has brought the warming shelters together for, since I think when the warming shelters closed last year. Yeah. We've been meeting every month. Yep. That represents close to 200, [19:58] Speaker K (unidentified): 1200 opportunities for someone to come in, someone to connect to services. That's what the brick church is looking at, about 1200 opportunities a year. So that's what they'll [20:08] Teal Vasquez: look at. So do we kind of have an idea as to why their applications failed? [20:14] Robyn Stanicki: I think I don't know why they failed, besides the fact that they had a certain amount of money for this area. And that's they decided to give that to the Brick Church. It was though, if you look at the list, Brick Church was the largest recipient in the state. And if you look at how it was broken down by counties, Penobscot County was given. [20:38] Speaker K (unidentified): Penobscot County had a higher amount. It may have had a higher. [20:42] Robyn Stanicki: it was it was not significantly less like in the previous year do we have a chance to give [20:48] Brittney Dunham: feedback to many state housing about this no i don't think so and i don't know that i mean my perspective is i don't necessarily know that we would want to that like it's really important that the largest warming shelter that we have in this area gets funded with the amount of money that we're talking about because like you said that would also allow for there to be some of those expectations that you know they're that they are making sure they're open every night they're making sure that They're able to have staff that they can retain that they're, you know, are able to train people, because it's like the minute we start taking, you know, to spread it out. [21:25] Speaker J (unidentified): Only means that every one of those shelters is just on, underfunded, and just to bring the example [21:31] Speaker K (unidentified): home, what training do they receive? I'm not sure, I don't work for them, but exactly nothing anywhere. [21:37] Robyn Stanicki: In the grant process, I believe they were asked to work with their staff on certain training. I don't have that in front of me, but I know that part of the grant process was that they provide training for their staff and also put everything into HMIS. So all that. [21:56] Speaker K (unidentified): Now two agencies that are outside of that funding and don't have those requirements. They don't. You're right. So how can the city set up something that mirrors those requirements for those agencies? So that we're all looking apples to apples at the end of the season. [22:08] Melissa Ann Rhodes: And keep those other agencies, like the mansion and the other places, can they combine their training? Go over with the brick church and do CPR training, so at least they're trained. I mean, it would be very scary to be in any of those situations not having any of that. I totally hear both of you on that. [22:30] Robyn Stanicki: I know that Terry is planning on doing some training also, even though he did not get the funding, mostly around Narcan training. And I think the options team has done that in the past for him. Right. I believe, Pat. [22:46] Teal Vasquez: Yeah. So they, you know, you said before that, like, it's not necessarily in service of the community to have providers doing like case management every other day. But it isn't necessarily great for the providers of warming shelters to be in the same boat either, where they're doing bootleg warming shelters because they don't have the funding that they need. I mean, obviously the brick church has great capacity and I don't want to beef with anybody in the community because I think we all want our community to live, or at least I hope we do. But I know that, you know, just to pick an example that I know of, because I was inside the building, I know that Together Place did that more frugally than any other warming shelter last year. And it doesn't seem like they got any brownie points for that. And I do, I do worry. [23:43] Speaker K (unidentified): You have to understand, too, that the larger the service population that we can serve in one building, the lower the staffing, the lower the overhead costs are. So the larger the program to an extent they can't get too big of them the extents and it gets to be expensive but and we are extent that we have it we really need to support our largest our largest [24:02] Robyn Stanicki: Provider first so that we can get the bulk of people and we have been talking about you know those people that you know do get asked to leave one shelter and having that communication between Terry and Leon and making sure that those people get to a safe place and if they cannot not take either place than getting a hold of me or someone else that might be able to help them find another safe place. So that is being talked about and worked on. [24:33] Teal Vasquez: So I do want to move on from this topic. Again, we have a lot of things here. However, you'll see that item number four is to set the discussion for the next agenda. So I think obviously we're getting to the colder months. This is a hot thing that we need to be discussing. So I think once we circle back to that point, we probably will all agree that needs to be a topic for the next discussion, but I do want to make sure we get everything on this agenda today. So moving forward with updates, an update on Project HOPE. [25:03] Robyn Stanicki: Great. So the last time that you met, I provided an update on Project HOPE. Project HOPE was the program that was done in the city of Portland, supported 70% or so by Main Housing. They presented the opportunity for the city of Bangor to participate in this program. It was brought in front of City Council. City Council recommended that it came to the advisory committee. We spoke about it last time. You provided a recommendation that it should pass and the matching should be a 50-50 split between community development block grant and opiate settlement funds. That was presented to City Council during City Council workshop. City Council, when it went to vote during the regular City Council meeting, the motion was made to delay the vote so there could be more discussion on where the sources of the matching should be. After public comment, the City Council decided not to pass Project HOPE. So at this time, that proposal is not in front of City Council. The partners involved in that project, Maine Housing, Bangor Area Homeless Shelter, Preble Street, and Community Care Shaw House are meeting this week to discuss what other options would be on the table. This is an evidence-based program that has shown great results, and we want to make sure that we have turned over every stone before we say to Main Housing that we can't do it. What is the deadline for Main Housing? Main Housing has been great to work with. They said that, you know, let us, let us go through the process without a deadline. Project HOPE case management. [26:54] Speaker K (unidentified): How does that differ from targeted case management, which is already happening? Sure, so what's a little [26:59] Robyn Stanicki: little bit different about this program is that, as you might be aware, in order to be reimbursed for case management, you only have certain reimbursable services. This type of case management allows for whatever support is needed, whether it's reimbursed or not. So say, for example, one of the things that we have also, we've been often experiencing in the community right now is like driving around and looking for someone and just having that constant engagement and relationship building, which is foundational, that's not typically a billable service. And so it allows for that. The other thing is that it's really focused on meeting people where they're at, building those relationships, and then seeing them through the whole process. And then when they're housed. So it just has a little bit more flexibility and it also allows for a smaller caseload. So it really is that individualized, intensive time together. [28:00] Teal Vasquez: Questions regarding Project HOPE and the update? Hearing none, we'll move to the next agenda item. So the third agenda item is committee appointments. So for all, everybody here knows that our committee terms are finite. We have three committee members whose term expires at the end of 2026. So I just want to remind everybody that if you would like to remain on the committee, you go through the same process as when you originally applied. You must go to the website, apply, go through the same process. And for those that are listening or seeing from beyond, if you are interested, you may go to the website and apply as well. But I just wanted to make sure that didn't fall through the cracks. I would hate for us to get to December and be short three people. People. So I wanted to make sure we brought that up. Any questions on that? Moving on. So in the packet this week, there was a homelessness response system roadmap. So I generated this document. I took some of the documents from a previous agenda, specifically the document provided by Chen and Bruce that kind of laid out where we were as a as a community, where things were situated, and tried to build what I thought the committee was really looking for, kind of a very easy to digest kind of path, right, and different buckets that we can really focus on. The purpose of this document is not to be all inclusive. The purpose of this document is to help us as a committee have guidance have kind of guide rails to ensure that we are having productive conversations during these meetings and not going all over the place. I think public comment at one of the recent probably most of the recent council meetings has been that sometimes the committee is not necessarily staying very focused. So my hope is that by creating a document like this being very deliberate in the conversations that we're having meeting to meeting will allow us to remain focused and to produce results and get to that strategic plan that we owe council in seven months. She's coming up very quickly. So with that I will kind of open it up. I'd love feedback. I'd love thoughts questions. Okay. [30:39] Amy West: I really do think it was a good starting point. I really do and I think for the folks that are doing the work there's like the color commentary that at some point as works through it I think can fill in the gaps or like on paper this looks very robust like what isn't working about it. So as you find time to like work through the document I think that will be really helpful and like any little [31:17] Teal Vasquez: which was the intent yeah right like let's just get started on a very deliberate easy to digest plan and then Jason the document you submitted like that goes hand in hand. We could we could sit down and say okay we're going to have a meeting about prevention and now we can refer back to your document other documents that have been submitted to the committee and say okay where are the pieces in prevention that we want to work on to put forward right giving us structure for what the strategic plan needs to look like I thought was important and I mean we've had some wonderful conversations but we've got to start getting focused and start moving the needle a little bit and again my hope is that this living document breathing reading document to help us do that. [32:03] Amy West: Thank you. Any other feedback? [32:08] Speaker K (unidentified): Under shelters on page, the second page in, what isn't listed is Partners for Peace, a domestic violence service that includes shelters. I'm wondering, under shelters again, and shelters is that capacity no family shelter that's something that i addressed in my document limited low barrier day space is something addressed in the document lack of organized communication and coordination in the system and i wonder where the region three and the coc committee meetings come into play when it comes to that particular part lack of organization communication and coordination in the system and how much of that we could look at and how much is the city giving region three and the coc are they getting what they need is the coc in region three meeting is giving us back what we need and i'm wondering if that part in the shelter process is something we could look at in the document under stabilization i returned refer to it as you know referred to it as inappropriate discharge from institutions not just detox but from all institutions and i think that we could look at that whole situation how are people coming out of an emergency room what does it look like when someone comes out of detox and has to go back to their camp our questions under housing i have a simple very simple question on this page is where is the housing committee at i guess that would come to you [34:03] Melissa Ann Rhodes: at the last council meeting the city council voted to add a few members i believe that [34:13] Robyn Stanicki: there's just one vacancy left on that committee and then perhaps i could start meeting on [34:21] Speaker K (unidentified): On page two, or on page three, under number two, you doubled pet barriers twice. Canceled out pet barriers. Under number four, Committee Action Roadmap, I was wondering if we could separate under the three to nine month section, identify interim options for family shelter, and then the end, when that ends, make your older loans quickly and separately get on the list. Just a minute. I will ask you all to look at the document that I wrote. It does address most of the stuff that's in here. Some of the sections are developed as formal goals with measurable steps, while others are shorter statements of direction. It's just I think this is what we should do. Thank you. [35:17] Peter Patrick Kealy: I didn't know that I had been able to figure out a place that relies on the peer support as well as the H-Sides and the obstacle county overall response team, you know, what I do to be in contact with stakeholders, otherwise like two real important peer driven services that I, you know, I get represented is what's the way to go. While [35:42] Teal Vasquez: we're on that page, I think we're on one here. I'm not seeing a lot of recovery. Like I'm seeing some detox and stuff, but it does seem to me that would be at least would behoove us to have that as more of a categorical or a header sort of thing. I think that's a major part of the diversion process here in Bangor. I mean, when people are eliciting diversion services here in Bangor, it is often coming from recovery centers and the peer support professionals there are often the ones on the phones getting that hard work done. So I would think that like, and I just generally think like in terms of the conversation that it would probably behoove us to talk more about recovery as part of this. It's probably, you know, one of the biggest contributors to the situation around us, I would think. So, yeah, that's something. Just, again, I mean, it's kind of like where Pat's coming from, where it's like, that's where we're, that's hometown for us. So, we worry about it. [37:04] Ben Treat: I really appreciate hearing what everyone's saying. I've been trying to jot it down so that I don't lose my job as secretary, right? okay but it's it's an honor so but so i'm thinking i've heard three threads that i think can be pulled through the document without changing the color code and i it's just like making sure these threads are present and one was regionalizing you're talking about the region three homeless council i'm like what 's our connection to things outside of the boundaries of the city another is transition as people move from one spot to another in the chart or in it like is moving from being like addressing prevention with them to maybe housing or stabilizing transition is important. And then another is recovery rate is like that's another threat that can come through. So I think that's really good if we just make sure that those get represented. I like the structure. Another one that I thought would be good to pull through is affected others. I think we have a lot of people who are watching the work of a committee. And none of this addresses what I'm feeling as a housed person that's seeing things happening, you know. And so I'm just, I'm mindful that 's a population that's watching us that's going to judge the outcome of things and including all 12 of the council candidates, right? So that affected others group can include somebody who's someone who has a loved one who's homeless and using substances. It could be a person who just wants to use a park and sees a needle. You know, they're all affected others. But it's people who are not experiencing homelessness, but they're in some other category. I think it's good to include them. And then the other thing is I just had a later meeting, even maybe the next meeting, I think it'd be good to have more specific than the really good timeline that you have there, something more specific that has like specific deliverables, just so we can say, well, our homework, our final project is due July 31st or whatever. Whatever. And that means we need to have a really final draft by July 1st, which means that we have to have a really, you know, good rough draft by June 1st. You know, and so we work back and identify what our deliverables are for having something to counsel in time so they don't [39:40] Teal Vasquez: fire me as secretary. You bring up some great points to it. I do want to point to the very last bullet on the last page was my recommended framing of this whole thing and I will read it for those that I'm just Bangor should evaluate success not only by the number of programs available but by whether a person can move through the system without losing contact waiting indefinitely in a bottleneck or returning to homelessness after treatment or housing so I think if we can in my opinion if we can operate with that mantra if you will that allow us to attack a lot of these things and if we just keep that in mind I think it solves some of the things we've talked about right somebody who is in recovery making sure that they're getting the support all the way through it doesn't it shouldn't stop at any one point and it's one of the reasons why I liked the like the way this is laid out for me just the way I learned and the way I see things I could see the progression I could see the path right and so it for me anyway it allows me to kind of process a little better but the goal is to be able to create a plan submit a plan that allows for a person to work their way through the system guided without any bottlenecks without any issues and if we can attack every one of the issues with that mindset, I think we can get to a really strong deliverable. [41:10] Speaker K (unidentified): There are 15 of them. [41:13] Robyn Stanicki: Alton? Hi. Can I just offer something? Please. I think one of the things that overlays this whole thing is policy because as you develop your strategic plan, one of the things to consider is how to keep it sustainable, and policy is often a way to do that. So maybe through this, it's also an identification of policies that are barriers. Policies that are facilitators and then those gaps and policies that could really ensure sustainability of whatever's developed here. It's a great point, thank you. [41:47] Teal Vasquez: It's a it's a very well composed document and I think you've covered most of the pressure points, you know, at least thematically, and I think that in that sense it's a very good springboard, you know, you'd be able to, I mean, people at this table are well equipped to know where the gaps are because we've helped them, I've been frustrated by them. Thank you. [42:14] Carolyn Fish: I'd like to just piggyback on Ben's comment. It made me think about just the past month of families that were in a tough situation on some of my listings. In fact, ironically, you know, a lot of the listings are from the older generation of Bangor and they're going into assisted living and they have adult or sometimes young family members who have either mental health or substance addiction issues and they themselves are struggling with going into medical facilities themselves and twice just in the past month an individual sadly had the stabilization of a home environment and then when he had to leave that environment he really had nowhere to go but his mother had a stroke and she was no way no longer able to help him and she had to go out of state with another family member and this poor individual ended up basically on the street, now has gotten involved in to drugs and now unfortunately has had multiple incidences with police, broken into the home which I have listed, which created another whole set of dynamics and the whole story is exceptionally sad because this person had been on his meds, had been very proud of his achievement and where he was at that point in life. But because of the changes in the elderly mother, he's now spiraled in just a month. And I don't even know where he is right now. And his mother doesn't even know if he's alive or not. So I think it's very important what you said, Ben, about the outreach to the family members who either don't know or suddenly become capable of providing that support and things like this. [44:03] Amy West: And how having stable health care improves your ability to obtain and sustain housing, and losing housing directly impacts health care, which then keeps you in this cycle of homelessness. So I mean, you teed up, I think, perfectly in the document where those things intersect, and that's, that's the part that's near and dear to my heart, right, how they impact each other. [44:34] Melissa Ann Rhodes: Thoughts, words, I think I'm just trying to lead back to what Carolyn said, and I said it last week, and exactly what you just said about the, you know, situation, and now how this gentleman is on the street. It's no different than what I was saying about her problems last week when mental health group started closing. What you're seeing on the street is exactly that gentleman, right, that can't, was his meds were given, the people that they were in these hospitals for a long time, their meds were given to them, they were taken care of, they were had the oversight, they had a staffing, you know, that no longer qualified and was closed, and now we're dropping them off at the shelters and they're taking, you know, oh here's a candy, right, it's really not the drug, you know, and now we're in the addiction pattern. And so, you know, that just, it just brings that up for me again because it's so, it really is big, and we have a lot of that on the street right now. People just don't understand, and they're not paying the mental services they need, or you try and they don't understand them, and they don't have the care or the staffing with them anymore, so it makes it really difficult. But as far as this goes, you know, I think it's great, I think both of your guys's documents are great, you know, I like the fact of, you know, the ending part of homelessness. This was a treatment of housing placement. And for me, like, I'm really sad to hear about the whole Project Hope thing because this part, I think, would be, it's part of it, right? This would help see this framing. So I hope eventually we get there with Project Hope because that is really what we need. [46:12] Brittney Dunham: It's also interesting to understand what the other projects that haven't been gaining the most amount of success in there, you know, within city council or within the community. Is that like when we think about the home for good projects and the ways that people are receiving 24-hour supports in the home for good projects? I think like this sentiment exactly is sort of what the what the like the nugget is for communities when we think about all the good that can come from the people who really like have tried, you know, Bruce has placed five times over again in different apartments that have been evicted or asked to leave because they've had too many guests or they've overdosed in their unit or, you know, they don't have the skills to be able to keep their units clean and then all of the for all of those reasons, you know, a renter or a person who is owns a home and is renting it out says like I can't tolerate this in my unit anymore. I know this is a huge cost burden to me, you know, someone whose place you were like thinking about listing and all of the support that goes along in those home for good projects really are the whole goal of the staff working there is to make sure that the returns to homelessness are not actually, you know, happening and that is evidence-based and best practice. And so some of the like hubbub that comes along with what the projects could allow to have, you know, happening there are just not based in fact. And so both though, you know, it's interesting that we have, you know, you sort of come up with this element and there's these two things that feel like they could be really positively impactful to the community and there's a lot of people who don't quite understand all the nuance of the of the work and what goes into it and how those things can be successful and really be helpful to and I think all of that [48:06] Amy West: leads to priority yeah number eight public communication and stigma, right? Because there's incredible immediate incredible compassion for this human in that example, but that is the tale of many of our folks that are out and a misunderstanding of how folks enter homelessness and how difficult it is to exit homelessness when there's a place to there's no off-ramp [48:29] Brittney Dunham: and I do want to put, you know, I know in our I hope that we've all been reading these communications but Boyd Cronholm, the executive director of Bangor Area Homeless Shelter [Speaker J (unidentified): wrote a really] beautiful email to all of us and the counselors about those two projects that I just didn't know when I was read. [48:46] Speaker J (unidentified): It shouldn't be read. We should think about how we're [48:52] Brittney Dunham: reading all of the emails, talking about incorporating them into the feedback. Awesome. [48:59] Carolyn Fish: I think, too, that the city has a budget which comes from the tax taxpayers and that's why we want this group together is we're not the experts we can be a partner but we have also maybe through this once we get a strategic plan sit down you know with the leaders of and see what we do have for budget but I think we've come to realize that over the years maybe you know hindsight's 20 maybe when we had you know the ARPA money it and it was a big chunk of money, maybe we could have done something bigger and had a much better result. But, you know, they did the best they could under the circumstances and trying to do it fairly. And I think, too, we still have the same problem. This city has to govern and run this city like a business with a budget. And so we don't have endless money to put toward homes. And when we have so many people, businesses failing, people that can't afford their taxes, they can't afford their fuel, and they think that all we talk about is homeless,, homeless. So there's the perception, and they're not wrong, that we're not paying, you know, they have issues too. So that's why we brought this group of experts together to try to be better partners and get a better, more effective response and effect in our community because we've been through it. So, you know, I see what you're saying, but at the same time, It's not the city's responsibility to solve homelessness. It is our responsibility to be better and better effective partners. So I see what you're saying. But I think that part of the reason the whole project got declined is because, you know, there's only so much money. And when we put a Band-Aid here and a Band-Aid there, I think we want to put the brakes on and see what we come out of this and see where we can best apply our monies, maybe get more monies to put into a bigger kettle and hopefully have a better. [51:03] Teal Vasquez: I think that's a great point. And I think that is a really great piggyback to what Jen said earlier about policy, right? Looking at policy and policies that can be updated, added, removed to facilitate more of this. Policies don't generally cost a ton of money, right? But it can facilitate somebody who has those resources, or organization that has those resources, to fill those gaps. And so I think that's where Jen's point about really spending some time talking about and looking at policy may be one of those areas that really can have the best impact in a very short order. Counselor's point, money is finite, but there are resources out there. We just gotta make sure that they can get here, and we have the policies in place as a community that allows them to get here. Just my thoughts. I wanted to touch on where we were on, which is me, whenever I take a standardized test, I just got all the pages strewn out, and I'm trying to answer question 79, I have the answer, but I'm doing it non-sequentially. But I do think that the communication piece is foundational, but in a sense, it's critical, too, because we can't gain purchase on some of these projects that are evidence-based, they're compassion-based, they're data-based, they're just based universally. And we can't seem to get the purchase that we might think would be there from our community. And I think, you know, in my experience, that is largely attributable to this stigma component, where people are coming to different conclusions that aren't necessarily supported by the evidence and aren't supported by the outreach workers and aren't supported by the people who know the community and the people who have studied it. And I think that in terms of the city's role, I mean, when I think about it, I do think it is the city's job to try and resolve homelessness. But I think that one of the ways that they can do that and be a better partner and do X, Y, and Z is to come up with a way to, because the affected others are, they're critical too. And without their support and without their trust, we're not going to be able to bring peace to this community at the level that we're trying to bring. And if we could reach them and show them, you know, in a better way and have partners in the city who are not just bringing the resources and voting on the resources, but representing them and advocating for them and, you know, voicing them, I think that would be, that would make a big difference, at least in my opinion. [54:22] Ben Treat: I'm wondering how you picture, or if you have a specific picture, maybe you want to leave this open to the committee, but how you picture us kind of dividing up the work of this and kind of moving forward. Word has, I see six color-coded boxes. Do you see some of these, or do you see it more like identifying specific things like recovery or regional response or things like that would be the subcommittees? Like, how do you, how do you see the work dividing up? [55:01] Teal Vasquez: Yeah, I think I would open that to the committee, right? Like, this is a democracy, right? Like, let's have a conversation and figure out what works best. The way that I sort of envision this document is as we're getting ready to build a strategic plan, that we would look at specific factors within it and say, okay, we're going to focus on the next meeting on, you know, prevention and how that relates to our zero to 90 day plan. And I think you hit the nail on the head earlier, Ben. I think we kind of need to figure out, like, a roadmap to the strategic plan. You know, what are the components of the strategic plan and how do we get there? And then this document giving us kind of the guidelines to say, okay, we know we need to talk about shelters or we need to talk about recovery and where that plays in. So we're going to dedicate a meeting where we have one bullet item is recovery, and then we think we'll have enough time to talk about a second time or whatever it might be. This document really is just to help us have some structure to the conversations, right? It's not meant to be the all-binding bible, if you will. It is just a road map so that we can make sure that when we're having conversations, we're staying on topic. And so that when we do start to navigate away from the topic at hand, we have something to kind of pull us back as well. So open it to the committee. [56:28] Robyn Stanicki: Sorry, can I offer a thought on this? Is I think one of the things that the committee may want to talk about at some point is the format of your strategic plan in terms of strategic plans can go in many different directions, but some of them start with like an objective and then talk about activities. And, you know, you may want to at some point start to think about how that shakes out. Often in public health, we do something called smart objectives where they're measurable and then there's activities that come down after that. So I think as you're having the conversations, you can start to think about what do you want that format to look like. I [57:14] Teal Vasquez: think that makes sense. And I think that, you know, you've kind of formed a pretty natural timeline here with the categories themselves. I mean, it seems like they're created in order of urgency to me. So I think a fairly natural way or organic way would be to say, we're going to circle prevent. And then the prevention experts tag themselves in and have more of a presence in that. And then we would move on to connect. And the connection experts have more presence there. And we could just go down the line. And that was my thought. I'd [57:50] Speaker K (unidentified): like to see a section in the very beginning of what we're doing that addresses some philosophical ideas. And I think recovery is one of those. Recovery is a philosophy. Not everybody subscribes to recovery. But we could look at what is the philosophy that our strategic plan is taking. Is it recovery-based? Is it person-centered? Is it trauma-informed? Those aren't necessarily headings so much as they are flavors through all the headings, like this is trauma-informed, this is person-centered. I think that if we were to look at some section within this plan that kind of identifies what the philosophy is, that might help, no matter what the topic is. These are the threads through it. We believe that people can recover. We believe in person-centered planning, that people have a voice in their care. Trauma-informed services, not trying to hurt anybody while we're trying to help them. [58:53] Teal Vasquez: That could be something we could weave into the strategic plan itself, where as we make recommendations, we can say that this approach is rooted in our local recovery network, like our local recovery professionals have endorsed this approach, or this is something that the evidence shows, like we can sort of, you know, as we go down the action items, supply tags to them that are like, you know, this is, you know, the, there's a word I'm shopping for, but I know it's wrong. We'll just say the origin story for now of where that comes from, and we can point to [59:34] Amy West: that philosophy, you know. So Jim was saying around like what a typical strategic plan might look like and identifying the values and objectives and like almost like a mission statement, so that'd be great. [59:48] Teal Vasquez: That's exactly what I was gonna say. I think what we're describing is really kind of the mission statement or the strategic plan, and then to both you guys, one, then we pull from those threads throughout the documents rather than splitting it up amongst a bunch of different places. We have one kind of guiding principle, if you will, to get our way through the strategic plan. That makes sense. I [1:00:23] Ben Treat: also just feel like the strategic plan needs to be, it needs to be something that the council can go back to. I don't play this to be critical of council, I just feel, I think everything does look like a band-aid when you don't have a vision, and they've asked us to develop that vision, right, and around this issue. I don't mean council doesn't have any vision, I mean around this issue, like they've asked us to develop a vision, so we want a document that helps council have a vision to move towards, and so we also want something that they're going to be ready to adopt, and so I think we'll need to have some clarity from council about what they're looking for as time goes on. You know, I 'm mindful that we did provide a recommendation on project hope. I'm mindful that it was almost like we weren't hurt, you know. I don't want that to happen with our strategic plan. That's a lot of work to put in to also have a shelf, so we need to hear from the council. They need to be responsible for telling us what they'll [1:01:41] Teal Vasquez: actually listen to so that we're not wasting our time anymore. And I think counselor, you have more knowledge than most of us on the inner workings of council, but I think that's where Jen's comment about policy really comes in, right. I think if as we're building our strategic plan we focus on policy, not hey the city needs to build this giant building, the city needs to do this, or the city needs to do that, I think if we focus on policy, then it's harder for the city council to come back and say it sounds great but we can't do this, we're not going to support this, right. I think if we can at least in phase one, right, I think it's important to keep in mind too that this committee is not ending December 31st, it's not ending July 1st, it's not, this is at least for now there is no end date on this committee, so I, in my opinion, I think that first strategic plan really needs to be centered around policy that makes sense in the community, because that's the link, right, that 's the way that council can Say, okay, we can pass this, we can do this, they're not having to commit a ton of resources, and then the next iteration, right? Because again, the committee is ongoing, right? And so when that strategic plan is delivered, it doesn't disband. And so from that point, now it becomes more of those finite things, it becomes more of those tangible things, becomes more of those what are the other tweaks that we can do to make sure that Boyd has the resources and the ordinances in place, that the Together Place has the policies in place at the city level to be able to operate effectively and efficiently. That's my thought, I think, to your point. I think that's the way to get in front of council and to deliver something that is actionable in a, I'm not going to say short period of time, but a relatively short period of time. At that point, if they balk, then it's like, okay, well, what did you convene us for? [1:03:47] Carolyn Fish: And I don't think it's a matter of will they accept it or not accept it. I think that we very much are excited about this, and I know all the committee members are watching, and we have conversation, and they're very much looking forward to this, and we know this is going to be like a living document. This time has changed, and also what we have to do is take that strategic plan and we have to go to our department, because you know a lot of the people here are stakeholders, and this is your day-to-day life, but at the same time our department heads, their day-to-day life is working with our budget and looking at, you know, fire and baby police and public works and how homelessness affects them and what our resources are and what they're not, we're overburdened, where we could give a little more. So we want to take this plan and seriously look at it, and then we have to go back to the department or the powers hours after I'm gone, and get feedback from them, too. And we will be, I'm sure they will be fine-tuning it and working with it and still coming back for advice. So I wouldn't be discouraged because one part, you know, one topic came back and for multiple reasons didn't pass, because the ultimate goal is to look at the strategic planning that you all have to say, which will be considered very serious. [1:05:03] Teal Vasquez: Yes, my one concern is, and I know that I am sort of a concern guru over here, and that's always my role. Pat knows from working with me that I am very good at bringing forth a concern, but I love policy as much as anyone else, like truly deep down, like I love pouring over a white paper at 3 a.m. or looking over a knowledge base and just not understanding anything but wanting to. But I would be wary that like one thing that committees are almost too good, in fact, almost certainly too good at making is policy. And policy is very actionable and it is very deliverable, but that is mostly because it is words. So, you know, I can see that the, you know, just role playing it over in my head, like, yeah, I can envision the council, So I can envision anybody just being thrilled to adopt policy because it's quite easy and it's quite cheap to adopt policy because it's words. And when I think about reducing deaths and honoring the providers that we have on the streets and the people that we have in the streets, I do think it kind of is like the city needs a building or the cities need more buildings or there needs to be more housing. And I sort of get to thinking that might be crucial, especially given the fact that people are dying now and throwing themselves off of bridges now. It's not an abstract problem. It's a now problem. So that's kind of my thinking is that I would like for us to have some sort of tangible monetary structural stuff in there too because, you know, I love policy, but, you know, it's a love-hate sort of thing. [1:06:55] Speaker J (unidentified): So that's my thing. [1:07:11] Robyn Stanicki: Can I ask a question? We just went back to the order. Just listening to everyone's comments, I just went back to the original order of the committee. And it says to construct a strategic plan for the city's response. And it's a capital C. So I just want to, it might ground us in, this is for city's response, which is different than a strategic plan for the whole city's response while it can include coordination but that correct me if i'm wrong this is about the capital c meaning the city as an institution not the city as like all the partners coming together although the strategic plan could include the city's role in bringing people together. Am I, is, we're. I think we're, [1:08:03] Teal Vasquez: I think I understand the same way you do. Okay. Council. Okay. [1:08:10] Ben Treat: City government, not everybody. [1:08:12] Robyn Stanicki: Right. So I just wanted to kind of like ground us in that because I think sometimes when we think of meeting, we're all solvers. That's why everyone's at the table. And so sometimes when we think of those problems, those solutions, we think really big. And so knowing that lots of us here are representatives of the city and knowing the strategic plan will influence our work, I just want to make sure that we're all talking about the institution of the city. [1:08:39] Amy West: And I think it's helpful to clarify to folks that are listening at home or watching this and saying like this isn't going anywhere them to understand the role as well clearly we're all learning the role and how we can what can be actually delivered and actioned upon and the public as a whole to understand what the point of the committee is and what we're providing or because we're having that little bit of internal debate I can imagine where there was [1:09:27] Teal Vasquez: For questions [Speaker J (unidentified): Clarifications so] With all this conversation I actually kind of circled back to the thing you talked about Ben earlier is should we have like subcommittees that are focused on very specific things and maybe reviewing what policies and I know love hate relationship I understand but reviewing what policies are impacting and maybe trying to figure out what policies are in place that are creating the barriers or what ones are working I think that's valuable [1:10:08] Amy West: Goal I also would counter just again being one of the folks that's delivering the care in the day-to-day we are having people actively dying I saw three suicidal people today because they're very cool and ignored a goal so I think that there's value to that and I'm curious if they're we talked about like the emergency stabilization component and if we're just looking at dorming centers are open in a month that's kind of the emergency stabilization component and like thoughts where we're going To focus our energy on and that will kind of reduce the pressure valve for us to be able to tackle with the subcommittees prevention stabilization connections on and I'm saying this more as like an ask to the committee is that are we looking at the warming centers like that's the emergency stabilization and we just got to get people to hold on another four weeks till warming centers open or do we need to also address this while we're looking at policy [1:11:05] Teal Vasquez: And the impact of like kind of the bucket of work, can you lay that out more? Like, I'm sorry, what? Like, I understand what you're saying, but I mean, I guess like, what would your physical suggestion be for that? Or are you asking for us to discuss that as just like briefly, do we think [1:11:27] Amy West: We need more than have people hold on to the warming centers open up in four weeks? Is there or any other intervention that anyone feels like we need to try to present now? I don't think there is necessarily another option in the next four weeks that we can actually be actionable. I just I don't want to be remiss if somebody else is seeing a gaping band-aid, not that we're trying to avoid band-aids, but the reality is we have four weeks of [1:11:53] Teal Vasquez: So I mean just I can't remember who said it, and I'm sure that it was very recent, and it does not mean that I don't think you're meaningful, it's just my brain is kind of like that. But I think it was you, Alton, that said we're all solvers. Jen just said it like ten hundred I'm so sorry I attributed it to a man. I don't know, I don't know But I 'm thinking I know that we're not supposed to think of the city astrally, but that's what I'm trying to think of when I'm thinking of like band-aids. I like band-aids. I would prefer to have a band-aid if it's going to keep someone here with us, and it's going to stop someone from doing something rather [1:12:41] Amy West: Dark, I'm just talking about like a realistic band-aid. Yeah, I just don't think there's a realistic band-aid in the next world peace. I just don't want to potentially stop. I just know that [1:12:53] Teal Vasquez: Like in times of crisis, you know, together place and other recovery centers and other shelters We've pulled Hail Marys, and we've called up a community partner, and we've said, hey, can you do, given the current acuity, can you open up your day space, or can you get some volunteers to extend hours? Do you think that would make a difference at all? [1:13:11] Carolyn Fish: I don't think it would be a bad idea. [1:13:12] Amy West: I think, I don't know, you know, our resource. Like I said, two-day alone, I can't do another night outside, I'm sure you think. And I've already seen for a place. [1:13:23] Teal Vasquez: You and I could talk about it, Bruce, and see what we can put our noggins to. You so why don't we do why don't we make sure this is an agenda item specifically for the next meeting that will give everyone time to kind of go back and think, because I think you make a great point. Like I don't know if there's a band-aid out there, but let's all put our heads together [1:13:40] Speaker K (unidentified): We've had a lot of viewers. Two weeks from now, it'll be only two weeks before it's open. Yes. [1:13:45] Amy West: But maybe someone will be able to be like, oh my god, that's your wonderful resource source that Bruce called a favorite or something. Okay, cool, sorry, back. Thank you, thank you, I. [1:13:56] Teal Vasquez: I totally appreciate that groundedness in the reality of that's, that is outdoors for our. [1:14:03] Robyn Stanicki: The diversion programs that won't help that, right, they work with people on trying to find places safe for them to go also, right, it's not just about giving them money for their rent, right. [1:14:15] Brittney Dunham: Correct, yeah, but I mean, it's not, it's not, it's not like hey, we can spend one night in a hotel or something like that, but it's certainly like if there's something that's being talking about, yeah, do you have, do you, would, what are the types of things you're thinking of? [1:14:36] Robyn Stanicki: Just like, I mean, back when we were doing diversion at the Hope House before, we'd always talk about family, oh for sure, friends, like are there other places that people can go and be safe for the. [1:14:50] Speaker K (unidentified): Winter area of meaningful time, do you have an area where you have meaningful time? Oh, that's not for. [1:14:55] Robyn Stanicki: Everyone, not everyone has that, but if we can get those people that do have those connections to a safe place for the winter, then I think we're well, we're taking the numbers down. [1:15:07] Speaker J (unidentified): Absolutely, I imagine Maria does that, I'm sure, I feel like everyone is still actively doing that. [1:15:14] Amy West: I think I'm seeing a lot of folks trying to use crisis as like a last minute hail mary, I just need a place to be to not get frostbite tonight, but I mean, the elephant in the room is in years past we were able to be like, can you get a tent, yeah, and we don't have that option anymore, so I have an actual fear for hypothermia and death in the next few weeks. [1:15:39] Robyn Stanicki: I don't think anybody should be outside, personally. [1:15:41] Amy West: I don't either, but there is no inside option at the moment. There isn't for another four weeks. [1:15:47] Speaker M (unidentified): Do we have ways to have a shelter that would be direct? I don't know. [1:15:53] Robyn Stanicki: We had an open bed, and we're able to get the one that was, I'm just thinking outside the box a little bit, but, you know, having a direct path right into it. There's just no bed. [1:16:06] Brittney Dunham: That's the problem. Yeah, because, I mean, it's not like there's any bed sitting empty, you know, and, like, so, I mean, we're going into overflow almost every night. I was looking at the numbers the other day, and I was, like, we're, like, over 100% almost every night. [1:16:21] Speaker K (unidentified): We have 10 overflow. [1:16:23] Speaker J (unidentified): Zero overflow right now. [1:16:25] Brittney Dunham: So if it's overflow, it's, like, it's in a chair. Yeah, well, we have mats, but yeah, we shouldn't be doing that based on all the other things, [1:16:35] Teal Vasquez: you know, capacity concerns and staffing concerns and stuff, and [1:16:40] Brittney Dunham: it's not, I mean, it's like, you know, someone's in the hospital, and then we take someone in, and then maybe they come back, so [1:16:46] Speaker J (unidentified): it's like an additional person, which we can certainly do, but yeah, I wouldn't think you [1:16:52] Robyn Stanicki: have, I mean, probably you have an extra bed with all the instructions done, all right, now [1:17:01] Teal Vasquez: So if I were to wave my magic wand and say, hey, you know, this community partner could open for six hours a night on, I mean, give me a break here. Like, tell me what you, [1:17:15] Speaker J (unidentified): like, my magic wand is very limited. What I have to say is going to be quite controversial, [1:17:20] Amy West: which is I think people should be able to have a tent for the next four weeks to be able to get warm and be out of the elements, but I know that is not an answer that anyone else is in agreement with, city ordinance, but in reality that is the way folks survived in the winters [1:17:35] Teal Vasquez: when there was zero bed available, city, right, because we're capital C city, say temporary ordinance, we're releasing a fat wall, controversial, but I'm happy to undertake some controversy, that's my role here, so I'm happy to [1:17:54] Amy West: just soak it up, everything I don't have the authority to say, and I wouldn't even want to have [1:18:00] Carolyn Fish: that, right, that opens up such a huge problem when you go down the road, your point, I get your point, but I just don't think there's an easy answer. I don't either, [1:18:14] Amy West: clearly, and that's why everyone's here, right, and just thinking about the health care component of it, right, which is like Pat said, I can do nothing to help anyone if they, if they're no longer with us, and even emergency openings require staffing and some kind of funding, which we know is unavailable. I really have not necessarily to be like, let's drop this bomb out of sheer curiosity, [1:18:43] Speaker J (unidentified): that's the only thing I can think of, is how are the pooling shelters down there, are they full, [1:18:50] Teal Vasquez: create the capacity too. Oh yeah, I just didn't know. Yeah, and there's a, there's a [1:18:59] Brittney Dunham: warming shelter planned to be opening too, yeah. [1:19:04] Amy West: Why couldn't the government have their own staffing funding? [1:19:09] Teal Vasquez: Why couldn't the city give them money to do that? I think it, like, let's not be, you know, the budget's voted on and it's a process. [1:19:21] Amy West: No, totally right. I think it's staffing, funding, and preparation, right? It's it's wildly expensive. Clearly four hundred thousand dollars is for 45 a night for bed, right? So what's that for an extra 30 days? And you have to have your staff, and you have to have them trained, and all the things. [1:19:40] Ben Treat: So sorry, when we say staff heavily, we mean volunteers. [1:19:47] Robyn Stanicki: I'd have to interject here on this. I think that volunteers are amazing. We've seen saw great things happen when volunteers come together. I think it's very hard to staff a warming shelter with volunteers. So I want to make sure that we are not advocating for a completely unsustainable pull model. They're great for bringing food and blankets and wonderful tidings. It's not a core staff for keeping a warming shelter going. Katie is paying $23 an hour for their staff. [1:20:22] Speaker K (unidentified): The Augusta Warming Center just put out their advertisement for their staff. So this is a regional discussion. People being paid to do this is a huge discussion in and of [1:20:35] Ben Treat: itself. People should be enumerated well. So there's the answer. That's why they can't open up a month [1:20:41] Speaker M (unidentified): early. I have a question for the folks who are participating in outreach on a regular basis. I'm just referring back to Bruce's previous point. Is that a standard question, do you have a place until the shelters open that you can stay for the next four weeks? Is there, I ask that question all [1:20:58] Teal Vasquez: the time, and the answer that I hear is I'm just gonna risk it, and so it's really cold in my tent, [1:21:03] Speaker M (unidentified): but I'm gonna. And then a follow-up to that would be, is there a way that the city could help if somebody says I have a relative in a neighboring community, you know, the mechanism for us to help facilitate that at least over the next four weeks? We do, if that's right, someone and I do, I'm trying to redirect the away from the tent thing because I do not think tents in our parks is the answer. So I realize that's available. I think what I'm trying to do is just sort of redirect about because Bruce brought the point up, and I think it's a good point, and I just, I think that is the answer until the shelters can open up, until the warming centers open up, is to try to find those resources. Well, hopefully that's, if I had a place to go, I've gone. People [1:21:52] Teal Vasquez: aren't, people aren't dying because there was an option available. I mean, they can choose it. [1:21:55] Speaker M (unidentified): Well, I can tell you in the last two weeks, we've had unhoused individuals left in Bangor, and they've committed crime and ended up in jail. They were not from Bangor, and I know I've said this before, I'll say it again. I think Bangor is becoming the answer, unfortunately, for people who don't have a place to stay, bring them to Bangor and park them somewhere or drop them off somewhere. And I think this is a wider problem than just Bangor and I just that [1:22:33] Brittney Dunham: needs to be part of the discussion yes just for you to so that you know too and I don't know how it is a Bangor area but we're asking those things at intake even to shelter to like make sure that there's beds that are sort of freed up like we're going to let someone stay sort of no matter what but we're asking if people have other opportunities or places to go. [1:22:54] Teal Vasquez: So I have something. Wasn't it St. John's Episcopal Church that allowed an encampment of four tents? And the units or the campers there created their own tenants to live by basically a constitution. That's what the church asked them to do after there were complaints. They said, create a constitution, organize yourselves, lead this project so that it's something that you can be proud of. And they did that. And then the city said well -oh well a school said next to them that shall not be named no one knows what it is but said you know -oh we don't like that and then code enforcement couldn't the city step in and say you know there's a moratorium on this or there's I'm sorry that's an inaccurate [1:23:34] Robyn Stanicki: story but that's an inaccurate situation description of the story [1:23:50] Amy West: I truly didn't intend for that to spiral I was just asked what do I think and that was an opinion [1:23:56] Teal Vasquez: And I apologize for spiraling I think it spurred some good conversation so well here's my hot take [1:24:03] Peter Patrick Kealy: Right this is how I was through you guys that's where I got my education that's how I stopped might not be the answer people were thinking were going to come out of my mouth right but I was the type of person who needed to be incarcerated bet your bottom dollar ladies and gentlemen I was that person right and that does work for some people right I know like I said it's obviously not the answer right I know that we're kind of we're real I know We're seeing wounds and stuff like that the jail can't even really take. Is that kind of almost accurate sometimes now? That's wild to me, right, guys? [1:24:45] Speaker K (unidentified): Are you suggesting that in the next four weeks people get arrested? [1:24:47] Peter Patrick Kealy: No. Okay. That is not my hot take. No,. But is it better than having a whole bunch of people frozen out there in a tunnel? We're at that frigging point, ladies and gents, right? We are at that point, Jason. Unfortunately, that's not what I'm suggesting. That's not what I want you guys to advocate for. I know you're not, right? Because now I get to talk to these guys on the other side. We'll leave it at that because we're all right. Seriously, though, we're at that point. We are dead in the center of that point. We are making that choice right now, right? Council's making that choice. [1:25:28] Teal Vasquez: Choice. Well, I think the question at hand is, there a recommendation that is not financial, right? We know that. Is there a policy that is stopping a warming shelter from opening right now? Is there a policy that is keeping a warming shelter from being open? Because right now, that's what we can recommend. That's what we can do. I think that's the COC. [1:25:53] Robyn Stanicki: Can I just add, there's another pathway here that we haven't talked about, and that is linking people to supportive housing. That also gets people inside. [1:26:07] Amy West: It releases a bottleneck. [1:26:08] Robyn Stanicki: It releases a bottleneck. And so I think this is maybe where we have the most ability to shift things. We have two projects that are in the pipeline. That's not going to provide us with an answer today, but maybe what we need to be doing maybe with Jen Lawler's help is to really talk about how do we ramp up as best we can that movement into housing. We do have some bottlenecks policy-wise around shared housing, around what's the other one? Master leasing. Those are actually programs that have shown significant success in other areas of even keeping people in their communities and not coming to metropolitan areas where all their resources are. So I think maybe this is where we have the movement at the moment is people with vouchers, people with, you know, if they are eligible for GA and have a place, maybe this is where we can have a little bit more concentration for those people who are, who don't have another option except for being outside. Just throwing that out there. Right. They found some coverage. [1:27:23] Peter Patrick Kealy: Well, I was going to say the vouchers are kind of hard in and of themselves for a lot of the people, right? I mean, when somebody's walking in and it's, yeah, you get a voucher, right? That's all cool and stuff. Up, but you ain't got a landlord that's going to take the thing, especially if you know, you, we do have some people around, we have some great organizations that are calling people in the background and helping people, and I mean, everyone's running around to be like, you know, everyone's trying to figure it out, and it's a good thing we're all getting together and figuring out what we have, right? I don't know, I went off there, so Councilman Street, Councilman, our legislative [1:28:04] Carolyn Fish: Legislative Committee is, I know this wouldn't be on the short term, but maybe somehow we could put it in our roadmap for strategic planning for a more long term. We're looking at our Legislative Committee is going to try to start working in pressuring legislators for more regional and state support. And we've identified, I mean, this is a long shot, I'm just sharing that, we've identified some property that the state actually owns over by Dorothy. And there's been conversation, there's nothing, this is just kind of these conversations that we've had, but we all kind of seem to levitate to the idea that we need some type of not maybe bail as it is, but between drug court and maybe a transitional correctional center, and I don't know if you know, we even bought this up the other day, I don't know what the Charleston Correction Center has vacancies or whatever, we're just thinking outside the box where somehow we can come up with a correctional Center when individuals are breaking the law to try to, and sometimes they have mental health, so it has to somehow incorporate mental health and background services, but also be a lockdown correctional facility if something happens, so it's not quite jail, it's kind of, but that's on legislature, legislate that now in our Legislative Committee, and I don't know Jenny if you heard that conversation, but this would be the idea to add some ideas to that, because you do, it's on our radar, and something's Going to be going to educate and try to pursue. [1:29:43] Peter Patrick Kealy: Jason, yes, but I was just going to say that something I've been through myself, and that is a step we all find to seem to be missing, not only on the correctional side, but on the recovery side, on the end of that stuff too, right? If you are, if you're getting out and you're on covation or something like that, it seems like, you know, there's no stop almost. Or you're expected to go to Fresh Start. Leading the way. And start living, or Leading the Way or some way, right? And start living again, right? I was living behind a gas station, right? I wasn't ready to go to like fresh start or something right away, right? Right. So they had stuff like I'm not trying to compare where I was from to here, obviously, because I've heard people say that stuff. But like there was like TSS, CSS, crisis stabilization service, you go to detox, right? Then you get billable through MassHealth, BankAid or whatever, like a 30 day is going to build it. Wouldn't be so much as correctional, right? More recovery, but it would be locked. Right. And you couldn't leave. You report audit and stuff like that. You know the section 35s and they went all the way from doing it at the state prison to actually easing it up years later and it was still a locked place but it was like a CSS TSL type thing and if you don't know you don't know and if you're not getting taught you're not getting taught right and I can yell my hat off to people on the streets I'll tell you this is how you do it please hey be safe do this and do that whether they're listening or not it's a one-word of the story. Do you have something? [1:31:20] Teal Vasquez: Sorry, I'm thinking. I don't really have anything other than yammering on about what I was yammering on before about, I mean, I guess you know, as a citizen of Bangor I'm kind of confused because it really felt like the messaging about the encampments on the train tracks was this is a liability and legal issue. The city doesn't own this property so even if we could wave our magic wand to say, we want them to stay here in the train tracks. We can't because the company is going to step in and remove these people if we don't. And now the language I'm hearing is there's no encampments at all. And I'm not trying to hijack your thing and soapbox it. I'm trying to do my own personal soapbox and stand on my own business here. But I very strongly and very voraciously believe that it should be legal to be homeless. And I don't think that the housing first model should be cannibalized by people who are saying the only option is housing we can't get there tomorrow in fact we're not going to get there in the next four weeks where it's very cold and in fact we're not going to get there this cold season and maybe not the next one so people should be able to stay in a tent in a sleeping bag and not die you said earlier you know and ultimately get the feeling you know you're going to try to mediate me and you Said earlier you would open a can of worms. I would much rather personally have a can of worms than a can of death here in Bangor. Like, I'll take a can of worms any day. I'll eat a worm right now. But a can of death, I can't stomach. And that's my main concern. And I think that, you know, personally just coming from me, if there could be a Band-Aid solution that could reduce death, it would be to put a moratorium on the encampments. I know that people aren't thrilled about them, but a lot of the public feedback that we're getting, a lot of the reason that our affected others are so impassioned and so hurt, and a lot of the reason that our community members who are unhoused are hurt is because Bangor has an unhoused crisis. ISIS. But our answer to it as a culture seems to be, how do we beautify it? How do we make it pretty? Well, it's not pretty. It's not a respectable or civil issue. It's people living in the elements, in survivalist situations in the middle of a city center. And so I acknowledge that campsites aren't pretty, but I've had pretty conversations in them. I've gone to the parks and I've sat in a camp and I've I've had some of the best conversation in my life and I would much rather have that can of worms and those good conversations than hear about a death of someone that I know and someone that I talked to and someone that walked down my street and that I was friends with so I do want to bring the conversation back. I want to make sure you've got a chance to share your point, feel it, and I do also want to be clear that nobody, I don't believe anybody at this table wants anybody to die, right? But we also don't have a magic wand as a as a committee to solve all of the problems overnight. And so we have to be realistic with our own expectations of what we're going to be able to facilitate as a committee. With that in mind, we are also coming close to time and I want to make sure that we have a meaningful conversation [1:34:35] Robyn Stanicki: about the topic for this question. Yeah, it wasn't pretty and I mean is a way that we can help will the bottleneck in the shelters to be able to free up more space is there something we can do more resources more anything I show that if [1:34:55] Teal Vasquez: I can circle back to that, yes. All right, so I think the next one, now the next item on the agenda was to discuss the agenda for next week or next meeting. And I think certainly we need to make sure that the shelters is probably the topic. Like, we have to have that conversation. We need to make sure that we understand the situation as it stands today and understand the situation as it could be potentially. And so one of the things that I have added to the agenda is, you know, what information and what outside resources do we need to be able to have a meaningful conversation regarding the warming centers and the shelters for next meeting? And it sounds like maybe having Boyd, if you are available at the next meeting, to speak on that topic as a subject matter expert, but who do we as a committee want to have come in and be able to be a resource for that conversation? I've added that to the agenda to make sure that these conversations are moving forward, we're having meaningful conversations to get results. So I opened to the committee, what information do we need from city staff to have a meaningful conversation regarding the shelters and the warming centers, and who, if anyone, do we need to bring in from the outside as a subject matter expert that can provide the insights and the [1:36:17] Speaker K (unidentified): knowledge that we need to facilitate that? Pastor Litka from the Brick Church, I'm asking you guys, [1:36:23] Teal Vasquez: like I think that 's what this if we think that person can bring value I guess like [1:36:28] Amy West: for what, yeah, I guess where are we going to gain from, yeah, because that's two pieces [Carolyn Fish: and also] understanding that like the capital D city component, it seems like we're gathering information from stakeholders. What were then we asking the city to do? Well, in the sense of like, yes, can you gather that information? I'm not sure what information we're looking to gather from [1:36:57] Brittney Dunham: some of the people. I would like an update from city council about whether or not the additional warming shelter can happen, and then if so, what the timeline for making policy related to what the threshold is going to be for how that's going to open, when that's going to open, and how it's going to be staffed, like how it's all of those things. So one thing that may help [1:37:22] Teal Vasquez: real quick, Jason, the third item is I want to make sure we set a measurable outcome for the next meeting, like how are we going to evaluate whether or not that meeting was successful. So Jason, talk about, everyone else think about what that could be regarding, actually you brought up warming centers [1:37:37] Speaker K (unidentified): And something came to mind. I have a question. Will the warming center go out to competitive, to a competitive bid? Is it going to go out to an RFP? [1:37:48] Robyn Stanicki: No. What we're proposing to have a conversation with City Council tomorrow at workshop is that Together plays with their experience would help with the overflow on the coldest days. [1:38:02] Brittney Dunham: And is the ask to City Council, I should have asked this before, but is the ask to City Council that there's like a monetary piece that needs to go along [1:38:09] Robyn Stanicki: with that? In our memo, we've provided an outline for what that would look like. I [1:38:20] Ben Treat: feel like I feel like we're we're not here to advise Main Housing, we're not here to advise any of the other entities that are out there, we're not here to advise the theater, we are here to advise the city. So I think we need to big city, so I think we need to get an update on what actually happened in that the council meeting tomorrow. I think it's and, I mean, I really hope that the council doesn't refer it to us. And, like, I think that's probably it for there being a Together Place option. If it's referring it to us and then we talk about it on October 27th, I do hope council can make progress without us having to weigh in. But I think we need to have an update because if council does need to hear from us, if they really need us to study the issue, boy, I'm not sure that it'll be ready in time for those days that the Together Place space is needed. I think what we need to get from Camp Out Shelter and Mormon Place is literally just what the city's response should be. And it sounds like that is going to be fairly small. Most of the funding is going to be from Main Housing and from private donations. And there may be some city response as well. And so we would just be, we just need to hear about guiding that. That. In that vein, I don't necessarily need to hear from Leon because Pastor Leon has funding from Maine Housing this year. If we're all here again and Pastor Leon got zero dollars from Maine Housing next year and mentioned got funding, then we would need to talk with Pastor Leon. That's the sense that I have. We need to really hyper-focus on what relates to city government and not focus so much on the broader. I think we got a good broad overview today. Next meeting needs to be more focused on, specifically on city response. And honestly, I think it's responding to whatever happened in council tomorrow and making sure that we understand that, and that if there's any recommendation we need to make, that we make that recommendation. [1:40:46] Speaker K (unidentified): I do believe that, I do hope that the city does refer it back to us. I think that we have an opportunity to look at a systemic, in a systemic way so that we have a we can a response for this situation next time it happens so that the city can have a contract in place can have what they need in place can have an understanding of what all of the contractual or agreements that need to happen because like main state housing has a list of you will do these things for the money so if we could come up with a list of these are the things we expect for the money When the city does give money to warming centers, they would already be an expected list. [1:41:28] Teal Vasquez: I would argue that could be part of the conversation next week, right? That would be a policy that we could recommend to the city as part of the broader warming center shelter conversation of, hey. [1:41:41] Speaker K (unidentified): I would recommend you read it all, but go back to page five and read two pages. [1:41:45] Robyn Stanicki: Could I also just add to the conversation that last year we did provide money to two warming shelters? We had a contract with them that had requirements in it and what they needed to offer. And it also had reporting requirements that we tracked on a monthly to every other month basis. So we do have something that we can build upon. This wouldn't be something that would be starting from scratch. I think that one of the other pieces of policy that could be helpful is, based upon what Portland did, how to create the weather policy, because that's really where there was a lot of trick to it. So if there was a recommendation from city council to proceed, I just want to tell you about timing. So we meet again in two weeks. And it's cold. So I just wanted to say, like, in terms of timing, I just want to make everyone aware. [1:42:33] Brittney Dunham: Yeah I want to just counter to your like point Jason like I hope that they don't push it back to like I think like that we don't want to be the thing that delays like we want it to happen and then if there's additional policy that we can come up with to help move the rest of the conversation along I wouldn't want this like yeah because then we're at four weeks and we haven't done anything you know and then there's no ability to say okay here's everything because then the work has to [1:43:00] Amy West: Happen afterwards, so that's just my opinion. There's already been preliminary about the [1:43:05] Carolyn Fish: Together place and council's very aware of the urgency of this, so I think that they will be in a move tomorrow to make a proactive decision and not kick it back. But again, along the same line, I think that moving forward any creative policies so that we're not always in, you know, reactive emergency every year depending upon how many state housing funds, if we had plan B and plan C to, you know, refer back to as a policy, that would be very helpful. [1:43:40] Teal Vasquez: I had a question, I think it might be a Robin question, but I'm not sure, I can be a bit forgetful. Is do we, do we have some data on this weather project and policy from Portland available to us? [1:43:57] Robyn Stanicki: We don't have it available today at this meeting, but I've spoken with colleagues over in Portland and they have a policy that's public that we would base some of the conversation on. It's very interesting how they had to talk with the weather station and how they made the call in 24 or 48 hours. There's a lot of things to think through when to open and when not to open and lessons that they learned on how they would have done something differently. [1:44:28] Speaker K (unidentified): CDC has climate and health documentation. It's about how to set up a warming center. It's a guidebook that they published. And then Mass Care Services, MEMA, has a guide and a pamphlet and an actual full guide on how to set up a warming center. And they both have different approaches to weather. So we do have some information about this. [1:44:54] Amy West: I would just also say this, having the ability to draft a mission statement that also really clarifies scope in the sense of like there's Amy as a person and how I think homelessness should be responded to and then there's Amy as a member of this committee and what advice I'm giving within the work that's being put in front of us. And I think for us to be able to have a mission statement that delineates the difference between me as a human and like me as a committee member, because there is a little there is a difference and a mission statement i think could help us focus our energies and look through it through the lens of like what 's being asked which is city capital c i think that was really helpful for me jen so i thank you city capital c [1:45:45] Teal Vasquez: So could some of that data be made available to us? [1:45:52] Robyn Stanicki: Yes, absolutely, I can gather all those documents. I think tomorrow's conversation with city council will really help us to understand, and I'm more than happy to get those policies together. You're welcome. [1:46:05] Speaker K (unidentified): Could you also gather the, information on what is, what are the requirements when, the city's paying for a warming center? You said that there was some things, could you gather those? [1:46:17] Robyn Stanicki: Absolutely, what I can do is I can provide the RFP that we had last year, which sets that up, which is basically we mirrored the main housing funding. So we were all in alignment, and I can provide the RFP from last year. [1:46:33] Teal Vasquez: So what actionable items do we want to walk away from the next meeting? Are there additional pieces of information we need from Robin, from Jen, from Bruce, from Chief Bushy? Review [1:46:53] Amy West: The contract and policy as it stands, provide feedback if there's anything that we would like to strike or add based on what the committee thinks should be included in expectations if the city's providing things to the warming center. Those feel like small actionable items, but could generate a lot of conversation, but I think with the warming centers coming and opening soon and this having a sense of urgency, that should be the focus [1:47:20] Teal Vasquez: And do it, and do it well, and be done with it. To that end, I wonder if a small subcommittee of us [1:47:28] Ben Treat: Could meet with the appropriate person and city staff to develop something that we could amend slightly so that we have a thing to vote on and say yes to as a policy document. I'm hoping that this is a policy document being placed before the city can make a plan for a leashing together place as the weather solution, the bad weather solution. But whichever way that goes, I'd really like it for us to have at least a draft document that we start to say we're okay with, if not a draft document that we approve in the meeting. Because that does, that fit with what folks think is a good approach, like having a small subgroup, having suggested, I guess I'm stuck being one of the people. You sure are, bad, yes, but I'm, I think a small subgroup, obviously not for, it would, be able to get that to the rest of [1:48:42] Teal Vasquez: The committee, I mean, I think that makes complete sense and allows us to work a little more efficiently. So I mean, if you would like to take charge then as secretary and secretary Warming centers regarding farming center policy, this one, yeah, for the, a living [1:49:06] Speaker K (unidentified): Documents of the future, I'm happy to work with. Yeah, I just didn't do that [1:49:12] Amy West: You can't have more than that essentially. I'm sorry. Right. Well, can you have a [1:49:22] Speaker J (unidentified): staff, city staff, so that can be hard and [1:49:26] Ben Treat: all right. And so the goal is to have something that describes not the weather policy, but the standards and reporting. Basically, it's going to draw. [1:49:45] Teal Vasquez: Then you guys will then present at the next meeting for full committee review. Anything else that hopefully we can be at a point where we can vote on that and get it forward. [1:49:58] Robyn Stanicki: Yeah. Can I just add one more thing when we think about the policy? Bruce has been doing a lot of work over this last winter and this winter about sort of the non-monetary pieces, like outreach, coordination among officials. So I think the policy could also dabble in these other coordination and communication efforts that are also happening peripherally by capital C city in coordination with the other agencies. I [1:50:35] Carolyn Fish: think we have to be careful about that because I think there's state laws about municipalities have to be careful how they create policies where we can't set policy for other non-profits. [1:50:53] Robyn Stanicki: Oh, sorry, right. No, I'm saying policy in terms of like the homeless response coordinator's role in warming shelters, not necessarily the other non-profits. Yeah. But like the public health department has a role in this way. [1:51:08] Ben Treat: And again not setting policy for the together place or whoever, but setting a standard for when we, when we in this big city fund something, this is what you have to do. Let's take a, let's [1:51:24] Speaker K (unidentified): take a solid example. Excuse me, if the city were to say that for every awake, every 10 or 15 people they're awake in a walking center, they need to have a staff person, I think that's a great conversation with the subcommittee. Is that not just that, but is that a, is that a city policy [1:51:41] Ben Treat: or is that directed? Yeah, I'm really conscious that we have other things to accomplish and we're at [1:51:48] Teal Vasquez: time. Yeah, so I agree. So I think that is a great question. I think it comes up at subcommittee. So it sounds like we've got a plan for a subcommittee if you guys want to connect and meet, not a forum, so you can do that, and then any other last minute things that need to be discussed. Two quick things. [1:52:06] Melissa Ann Rhodes: Yes. I am curious on where we went with when we emailed Ben about who we wanted at tables, where that was going and where that went. And then if we're still looking at doing that eventually or adding that to the agenda. And I also eventually, like, we get a ton of emails. We're already doing them, but we're not discussing them. And I feel like to get back to the public and get them to do so. So, yes, we're looking at them, but they're not getting anything back. So, eventually, I would just like to kind of circle back to these emails that we did put an email address out there, and I feel like they do need to be stopped. [1:52:46] Amy West: Yeah, that would be a standing agenda. [1:52:48] Brittney Dunham: Yeah, I emailed, actually emailed about this today, because I was, like, worried when I saw all of the responses, and it sounds like they're just, like, an autoresponder, but. [1:52:57] Melissa Ann Rhodes: But yeah, I mean, we're reviewing them and reading them, and there's some really good stuff in there that we could also utilize that the public is, you know, putting out there for us, so I feel like we need to give them some attention. [1:53:11] Teal Vasquez: And in response to your first question, I know Ben has been collecting, and he's shared some of those names, I think it would behoove us to tie that to when they're pertinent to the specific conversation, so it's helpful to have that database of people like if we know we're talking about that's why z we could work with them but great question and yeah I have a good point on the email I've shared all of them with you [1:53:34] Ben Treat: I didn't I didn't hear from most folks and so if folks have other people they want to bring forward as I think you've only heard from three yeah all right Jason do you have one last [1:53:47] Speaker K (unidentified): Thing I do can on the next agenda can we talk about the homeless response manager that's going to be gone that position is up in December so the city's got to look be looking at that [1:53:58] Robyn Stanicki: No so what happened is in the last budget cycle we changed the homeless response manager to a coordinator which is Bruce and that position is now a regular part of our staff so that position's changed to a coordinator from a manager and was approved in our budget.